tv Worlds Apart With Oksana Boyko RT December 26, 2013 3:29pm-4:01pm EST
individuals individual victims of abuses means that it means freedom but done for the state of the rule of law in russia i'm afraid it doesn't mean much well you just mentioned several other high profile cases that were part of the amnesty and again as i mentioned holocaust case is a bit different because it was totally up to put in the whether to release him or not it was his prerogative as president he could have chosen not to exercise it so if amnesty was going on anyway if twenty thousand people were going to be released including some of those very famous prisoners that you just mentioned that's what have created this public splash anyway in the political goal that you're alluding to would have been achieved anyway so why fight of koskie well first of all most political whim of the kidding because if you look into that amnesty it seems to be sceptical soviets toil traditional kind of an amnesty touching up on the vulnerable
groups of prison news pregnant women elderly people minors women with small children and so on and so forth and none of the last moment there is a month added on to include into the amnesty a specific list such crimes as hooliganism and mass riots and i would like to stay on for just one more question his imprisonment imprisonment had a symbolic value it was always presented as a sort of reflection of how bad the human rights to sion in russia supposedly was i wonder if you attach the same symbolism to his release doesn't mean that let's say political climate in the country may be changing simply because he is being set free while human rights watch is an organization nullus the case of course symbolizes everything that's wrong with human rights in russia in the uk quite to the office it. it's. the very last rights of case and there are many other cases
that we've documented so really and that clearly demonstrate that the redgrave human rights abuses including political money pollution of justice that are happening in the russian federation given that so many private profile people who have been involved in political activity have been released early do you think that signifies any change in the way the kremlin operates or indeed the political climate in the country while it's like the revolving door of russian political just is a revolving door of trumped up charges where you have some high profile political prisoners being released in one single week just before christmas just before the holidays develop should be ready to celebrate but done at the same time . people still remain in jail on three charges if we could stay on
the subject of what our cost in sochi olympic because you you mentioned that you believe that this was part of the political campaign and manipulation and it's interesting the holocaust he himself was asked about it during the press conference and i want to play this question by b.b.c. for you are you encouraging people to shop for infix or to stay away so essentially the. man who was released from prison thirty six hours ago after spending their year as the first one of the first questions he is being asked is whether sochi olympics should be boycotted on not and i think that's in itself a rather peculiar question but my question to you is whether you think that's what human rights campaign in russia has come to that it's not about human rights it is not about taking a stab at the government or better or putting personally well misspoke or first and . almost you're actually the one who's such
a political manipulation project that i didn't i saw the public relations project and i'm relations are. very close on labor the same approach but in the i'm not sure whether you know that it's a policy motto for human rights watch not all to call for a boy quote of sports or cultural events so all the musicians go through a good novel cold like quality of the your be musician is very. after is in the using the image of sochi olympics and i want to quote you something that's your call except rachel dunbar of the deputy director for europe and central asia for human rights watch just published an opinion piece on your website calling on readers to quote brace yourself for what could come after international spotlight leave sochi and i wonder what are you bracing yourself for do you see in her cost members will be rounded up again people will be able lynched on the
streets mall how they're close circle law says that she is not going to go back to russia because he does nor knew what a huge would really mean a dream own if he is on russian soil this and i was it. does he really had to live up to russia and unless he gets very small that security. this is not what he said he said that as of now he doesn't have guarantees of him being able to leave russia for our foreign countries for example for germany he needs to visit that country for example because of his mother that he isn't afraid of traveling to russia because he's afraid that does anyone actually if you are listening you know you are speaking for him that he never said that he said that indeed there are some legal issues with his skis that have not been subtlety have but if he has never heard of this but i'm pretty sure that while holder of course he is in germany over over his not going to go to jail now goes without saying. i'm also not
a free for the two women from the pool suicide bomb i don't think that they're going to be sunk back to jail as soon as the olympics are so what i what i see all of the rage of is that it. looks in the other direction from russia if the spoke laws is no longer on russia then the unprecedented crowd of civil society been witnessing easy going to intensify that's exactly what be afraid of because now they can actually see even more specific though what exactly do you mean i assume you mean the angio law that came into force about them oh yes ago i can not only that but i would agree that the law is indeed in the war of the crowd and down to this piece of legislation which is bodily quandary to russia's international obligations and freedom of association this non-governmental organisations get warning funding and advocacy to register poor in
asia such legislation exists in many other countries such as for example the united states and britain there is a similar law as well tomorrow night of you rather actually did i actually did and organizations that do receive foreign funding have to register with the state very well you receive palling funding and act on behalf of one which is over four in principle and that's a very different story here in russia if an advocacy group receives even a penny even a kopek of foreign funding even though it's completely independent from its dog is just a register so also why are they so love what is it doing there barriers of all as i did being a native speaker of russian and then resident of russia in this language in this cultural context agent means for inspiring to hear i think the connotations are the same as in. english for an aging in english doesn't sound pretty as well but people
use these terms quite often too is russian citizens very early in russian it means poetry loyce months the civically to demonize independent that to their is what i would like to ask you something different. this year justice ministry has decided to look how and yours are complying with this law and they in the shade if i'm not mistaken i think around fourteen cases of legal proceedings against various angelos and in line out of fourteen cases those and yours actually won legal proceedings in court against the state and this is in a country that according to human rights watch has no independent judiciary where the state prosecutors do just sad and yours how would that be possible well i would you want to ruin you have some dough but the problem was the first to wall the prosecutor's office actually launched this massive campaign of buna tive aggressive inspections and all in one fell the organization's rick choked across the country
and in some cases those inspections were just completely over the top where activists were all asked for their correspondence one of the prosecutors wanted access to their computers and so on and so forth but then dozens of groups received warnings i never orders to religion not one to course and one depressed sittings. in a sense that's one of the things that sort of makes me wary because they waited for the foreign agents lawyers that the law was adopted and then the minister of justice himself so he was unhappy with the law he did not know how the ministry would find it possible to implement it because there were almost all of it and for several months nothing was happening then in two thousand thirteen in february president putin has a meeting with the federal security service and the meeting he said listen body they really are. you know this no no governmental organizations how come i'm not
seen any implementation and as soon as he says that. the inspection compay is being launched and old as i do use it a little either from my direct question the or was it you show the court procedure a listen to this so this is how threatening and organizations are taken to court and they start losing their cases and the picture is really very grim and then in mid july president putin says in the face of very strong international criticism. they are going to reconsider will possibly among the law and once he sells it some organisations started winning the i.p.l. was and that's what you are referring to you see the shadow of mr putin in any single case in russia but miss loach and i really have to take a very short break now one day come back the russian government is often accused of using the law selectively against its critics but why did they break the law so easily that's coming up in
a few moments or will depart. dramas to be the worst. storm others. think since world rights. to pictures. from a good. deal. done. how does that look today a bit more depleted than usual could be that the masters of the universe online the n.s.a. change your bank account balance that's out there but up to. all those jokesters of
the it was just playing around with the financial system for a fall out of but it was a game i thought the reason they were involved in all that invasive technology was to keep us safe. these are. braving the elements in order to stand up to us oil giants. this comes after a massive hunger strike that returned the world's attention to the place that summed up jobs the gulag of our time. is an undeclared global battlefield in which yemen is just one of the front lines. there's a. welcome
back to all the parts where discussing the state if you want to write in russia of the time election not russia program director at human rights watch. just before the break we were talking about putting being implicated in pretty much everything in russia and i want everything to be high profile cases and told. well i think if you look around the level of paternalism is very high in this country and it seems that whether he likes it or not he is getting dragged on into. each and every case and i wonder whether it is sometimes the human rights campaigners that contribute to these very trying because when we have. controversy with greenpeace protesters
they had of greenpeace international was calling on putin to intervene now or we are discussing the horror kosky case and your again pinning that on to putin and his personal invasions the all the questions about you know whether those goals should be behind bars were again addressed to aren't you people like you or at least putin putin sort of for these play of words onto the pedestal he's just the president wired to treat him as this super being all of us are very unfortunate situation this boy called with the problem at a certain poor and the only way we to resolve a problem is to address putin and see what actually happens because the judicial system does not blame him for on trying living and this is the system that mr putin after the. new clause this past wick amidst all the only joisting of odorless
of political prisoners human looked like santa claus sitting under the j. gansett mom owns christmas tree in the kremlin handing out gifts of other costs. he also. told us exactly how it looked like and she knew one thing that i actually wanted to raise talking about political trust is just several issues to hold them finally became a free man an activist in the top russian thousand and two upset by the name of. call was sentenced to three years of the president in a clearly political case. it is the revolving door of russian justice. if it becomes a dragon to go well that's an interesting point that theory's because at his news conference in berlin. he was asked whether he feels any bitterness about spending
saw much time behind bars and. i would like to play what what he said. to. budge when i was running a large business in business i was fully aware. that i was a player in a very tough game commuter me. well conditional before she knew once the game you turned against me to reach became even tougher shoot him now i think he's being a bit vague here you can interpret that in many different ways but what i think he's saying is that he believes that selective justice was applied to him but he also recognizes that he did break the law and i think that applies to many of the people that you call political prisoners. activist greenpeace activists some of the defendants in the case and i wonder if you believe that the political nature of
their actions justifies them breaking the law while they're talking about the left of prosecution and disproportionate prosecution and there's the minister important thing here in the case of mr hodder well yes he says i've been playing rugby games but then at the same time we all knew that everyone who became rich as a result of russia's privatisation was breaking certain rules because the rules the very sort of lose and virtually nonexistent. if they're called to give us. though and i guess everyone else should be in the same jail with them in the virtue say that russian justice is not selective you mentioned that especially back in two thousand and three the rules of the game were not very clearly defined and what what our cost was locked out for you know was probably being done by many are there all the guards but now the state made it absolutely clear that it's not going to
tolerate breaking the law neither in respect of greenpeace activists nor in with regards to protesters attacking the police so do you think that people who defend human rights in russia protesters activists do they have to change their actions now to make sure that they simply protect themselves legally from the prosecution by the st paul on the one nationally have to abide by it. war on the other the laws themselves should be actually in line with relevant international standards the first thing that poor did when he returned to the kremlin was to run through the palm and a raft of laws which really detrimental to russian several and i'm talking in particular about being new restrictions on demonstrations the new restrictions on freedom of information including specifically freedom of information online and the restriction. rigid and it's very difficult for civil society to operate i wonder if
you're really following the social trends that we are seeing in russia because for many years the number of volunteers in russia has been on the increase and in fact the charities aid foundation just reported that last year russia made it to the global top ten by the number of people volunteering twenty five thousand people volunteering their time for the olympics what is that if not a sign of a strengthening civil society because in a country like russia where the sort of the fatigue of any collective action is very strong after communism years you know that when people are actually taking charge of their life when they are participating in gauging in a civil society is it just hundred volunteer movement is great and i just wonder who to see lou level for lunch would be initiatives flowing into the saudis actually. to see what's wrong problematic here is that the government is basically trying to split the civil society into the good civil society the bod civil society
and the good one is the one which is doing things possibly helping people without criticizing the government the bollard one is the one who's trying to bring about policy changes and actually rather needy this problem. actually trying to break the law and i think we can hear a transition to the case of police arrived two men. as of that band were just released on on the amnesty and dancing in the altar wasn't the most controversial action there were also famous for you know doing some stands that involved nudity and even something that looked like fornication in public i wonder i would like to ask you a personal question because you have a long record of defending human rights in russia do you think there is any limit to self-expression of political activist well rid of the expression search is not limitless it can be actually restricted to the restrictions of
reasonable by new means. the women from pussy of the group they had the right thing would realize see the rusted on trawick on disproportionate charges because they buy new means perpetrated and after all have been is with hate more than against russian which had talks with it it just didn't know what happened it's something they did not. really understand then you'll see of hooliganism moved to they did but really it was a little different so cool and want to be to kids it was really not fair judgement at all and he said it time and again and even did richest draw it administered to me and sentenced to a. human rights watch would not intervene and we're. going to scream to.
the court system in russia you've washed all of that particular kids very closely and yes it's a clear example of political manipulation of justice and the ruling was. a human rights watch operates in many countries and if you look around the world this issue of ethnic and especially of religious hatred extraordinary is. only prominent these days it's a major source of human rights violations in the middle east it's a major driver for wars now in syria in libya and in afghanistan in iraq so i wonder if you believe that in this particular case the right to a fun let's save religious sensitivities is more impart important than the right not to be a founded i think i said it but i don't mind repeating it again. her actual trial i don't disproportionate charges because the did moment perpetrate an act of call again the women want to learn sign by their actions and in fact during
their own pretrial hearing they actually apologized to believers if those believers feelings were a found it so if they apologize that done probably they recognise that that actions were a viewed as a phone call in russian orthodox that's not like i loved what the. federal and central mosque not at all i became tuned to the pussy riot case only one of the women were actually taken into custody prior to that one they just had their whatever you want to call it which is second performance which is second political stunt as a russian orthodox i was like. it probably wasn't a good idea to do this in the church again i'm russian orthodox but they should not have gone to jail because the only thing i'm trying to say earlier mentioned some of the positive developments
a rise of volunteering people being more engaged people taking to the streets i don't know if you would agree but i think that some of the political discourse in russia has become more diverse compared to let's say five or six years ago why something like that is not noticed by an international organization like yourself that is so devoted to the promotion of human rights and building the civil society but it is actually a chance to both three wicks of the here in this room i spoke to a quality of yours from russia to india about this situation with people with disabilities in russia. first of all one has to recognize the very nautical progress on the past two years especially on deposit with russia's ratifying the convention on disability and even though there is still very serious problem if progress is tough on italy in place even more so you are really excited elitist and sopped that russia is hosting the olympic games in addition to
the olympic games in salt because last time russia hosted the olympics as you may remember in nineteen eighty and the soviet union refused to hose the panels and i am actually. there are new does evil people in this country so yes a lot has changed in the in saying that russia is the same as the soviet you know a very it's a very it's a very good to hear because i think some of your have alliance wouldn't suggest that because you use allusions to soviet union quite a lot but given your misgivings about the human rights situation in russia i wonder if you could have made that russia played a positive role in the snowden affair because if it wasn't for russia he would. hooley have been lock locked out long ago and probably for a much longer duration than. well once now did the second. major statement saying that all the country that he had trusted with his requests. into
his claims and me objective decisions and this is apparently what russia has done and that snowden. temporary refuge in this country this same charm it's rather peculiar while given refuge chill while new whistleblower laws. one who is drawing to. an escape from d.s.s. or its is being a part of this soup of it russia is at the same putin says much russia on its own whistleblower there is this harassment a whistleblower is going on in the country including the whistleblower it's insulted there is a huge crush on environmentalist groups and only independent media that are trying to cover all the developments relevant to the olympics construction and that would be critical well i think what that shows is that human rights issues pro
probably a major problem not just in russia but in many countries around the world and i guess that means that human rights watch has to have a lot of adopted in the future unfortunately we have to leave it here because we are out of time i appreciate your time and this spirited discussion and if you like the show please join us again same place same time here in the wilds of. we rest here on this idea that we live in a democratic society if you abuse the instruments of democratic power they actually do you want living in a democratic power anymore. this is
extremely interesting. strategically she told china. islander cover a team of journalists trying to release wiki leaks documents about the how the united states is trying to. make me your local media more wrong arrogant they encounter fear ignorance and pressure. the country blocks the way to information freedom. media stop on our t.v. . the beginning of the long politic night moxley fades from island life. in sanaa and the temptation. to douglas last for six months. more than people.
and it's as easy to hire a rifle as a scooter. because the island is so in a special there are no indigenous people but there are all those who do choose this frozen life. this is this could be right about. why is the price of gold so high. demand global demand do you think oldest money. know the value of the only place we have. of the water that we need to survive it's not compared to people i mean gold we're not going to eat gold we're not going to bait with gold. we're not going to drink what clearly is and is in a desperate economic situation absolutely right what we're wrong to do is say therefore any kind of economic development from the outside is going to be
a benefit their only purpose is to extract as much money as possible to feed into the global financial system. with we are part of the geo political economic system that's extremely or split to do. first of all is a question with the mining should even be carried out altogether can it be done in a way which doesn't destroy people's lives resources environment soon will you know those are pretty serious questions mining is not a what a moment problem it's happening in asia in africa and south america and central america in mexico and it's even happening in canada and the united states. thank. you. think.
we up on our t.v. two thousand and thirteen has been the deadliest for iraq since two thousand and eight the wave of terrorist bombings now the u.s. is sending hellfire missiles and drones to help the iraqi government battle extremists the latest on that just up ahead. and on both sides of the pacific the fishing industry is facing economic shocks china has been shellfish imports from the united states leaving american fissures in the lurch while japan's seafood industry is still taking hits from the fukushima nuclear plant disaster more on these developments coming up. and here's a live look at the outside of the capitol building in washington d.c. where it is literally crumbling it is about to undergo the first.