tv Politics Nation MSNBC January 21, 2015 3:00pm-4:01pm PST
spying on other teams. so this guy is just -- you know he let's them do what they want to do just because, again, playing for the new england patriots. >> well, we are letting the air out of "the ed show" tonight. good evening and thanks for tuning in. we start with breaking news. president obama moments ago wrapping up a speech in idaho. the first of two red states he's visiting this week. where he's selling his vision of a stronger more progressive america. after historic state of the union address aimed at shifting the political debate to focus on issues of fairness and equality. >> number one, it means helping working families feel more
secure in a constantly changing economy. it means helping folks avoid college and we don't want to make sure that everybody shares in america's success, we actually think that everybody can contribute to america's success. and when everybody is participating and giving it a shot there's nothing that we cannot do. >> it was the same tone the nation heard from the president in his state of the union address where he laid out a progressive agenda for the next two years and beyond. promoting middle class economics, building from the middle out, not the top down. telling republicans who are attacking his policies on immigration and health care lee veto it. and on foreign policy saying that the u.s. must combine
military power with strong diplomacy. and his confidence was palpable. dashing any republican hopes that he would roll over as a lame duck president. >> if you truly believe you can work full
time and support a family of four on $15,000 a year, try it. if not, vote to give the hardest working people a wage. we seek the fastest economic growth in a decade. there's good news for you. i have no more campaigns to run. my only agenda -- i know because i won both of them -- [ applause ] >> that last line was the president drop the mike moment. driving more traffic on twitter
than any other. and in his final two years, president obama is trying to shift the debate to focus on a progressive legacy for america. and today in idaho, he demanded that republicans step up and work with him for the good of the country. >> watching last night, some of you may notice republicans were not applauding for many of these ideas. they were kind of quiet. my job is to put forward what i think is best for america. the job of congress then is to put forward alternative ideas but they've got to be specific. it can't just be "no." i just want -- i'm happy to start a conversation. tell me how we're going to do the things that need to be done. tell me how we get to "yes." i want to get to "yes" on more young people being able to afford college. i want to get to "yes" on more
research and develop funding. i want to get to "yes" for infrastructure for our businesses to succeed. i want to get to "yes" but you've got to tell me. work with me here. work with me. >> joining me now is congresswoman karen bass democrat of california and salon.com's joan walsh. thank you both for being here. >> thanks for having us. >> congresswoman, it's an energized confident phone from the president. how much pressure is on the republicans to help the president get to "yes"? >> well, i think there's a lot of pressure because, as you recall in his speech yesterday he really didn't put forward specific pieces of legislation. he talked about values he talked about you know the american dream. he talked about things that were very hard to disagree with. and so it was kind of interesting and we kept looking over at the republican side wondering how they could not
stand up when you're talking about equal pay for women, how you couldn't stand up when you're talking about education, k through 14. so i think my republican colleagues had a difficult time last night. >> you know joan here's what you wrote about the president's speech. let me quote you to you. >> thank you. >> president obama delivered his second to last state of the union address with an epic combination of sweet talking and trash talking, cajoling and trolling. anyone who tuned in expecting a conciliatory lame duck president was disappointed. to what degree can the president's confident and bold demeanor galvanize republicans, joan? >> i think people were really excited to see this president. i do believe we caught him in a fib, though. i hate to be the one to say it. because he said he had run his last campaign. he has not.
quote quote quote quote
that is him on the campaign trail today. he's going to campaign for these ideas and his agenda and the democratic party is going to be a lot stronger for it. >> you know the president
says there isn't a liberal america or conservative america. listen. >> over the past six years, the pundits have pointed out more than once that my presidency hasn't delivered on this vision. how ironic that politics seem more divided than ever but i think the cynics are wrong. i still believe that we are one people. i still believe that together we can do great things even when the odds are long. [ applause ] >> you know, congresswoman, i said last night when i heard him
uttering those words that i remember in '04 -- and i ran for president in that convention -- but last night it was even more powerful because here's a man who has been the subject of more unfair venomous attacks and yet he still believes in that necessary average. >> absolutely. >> it took a new kind of strength last night. >> i absolutely agree. i think he put out a program. he put out a series of ideas that really resonate with the american people. you know after the address, rev, i went to my office and i did a telephone town hall. i talked to thousands of residents from my district and people completely identified with his message and asked me repeatedly, what can we do to make these ideas policy and bills that he can sign so that we can have education k through 14. we know we have a big problem in our country with a lot of
positions that we can't fill because we don't have people with the skills. so having education k through 14 will absolutely make a big dechbs in difference in that. >> joan, how do you feel about this optimism that all he's gone through unfairly, everything unimaginable, some things i couldn't even imagine, yet he's still optimistic. >> i think history's going to look back and agree with you, rev, that this president has suffered so much disrespect and yet he does keep that vision. i love hearing representative bass talk about k through 14. i think our kids are going to talk about k through 14 not k through 8 or 12 but k through 14 is going to be the norm. he's laying out what should be the new norms and progress selfive agenda. he's got to have some help on the other side. he's not going to get it. >> congresswoman, a new poll finds that the majority supports
president obama's proposal. 51% back the community college, 58% support the tax plan and give the middle class a break and 66% support his proposal on paid sick leave. i mean this encouraging if the congress listens to the pope. >> we wouldn't even think twice about education and having to pay through education k through 12. so why can't you add two more years? i actually remember in california when it was free. that was about 20 years ago. so this is not really a new idea. and so the idea that we should go back to that i think is exactly what is needed in our country. >> joan, isn't he really pushing, though the agenda? i mean even republicans now are talking about income inequality
and fairness. >> he is. i think that the -- it's good. it's a good thing. let's give them credit for acknowledging that there really is a problem where some people haven't kept up and wages have been stagnant for a lot of american families under the trickle down policies that they have embraced and they have nothing more than trickled down. i know joni ernst was trying to show us that she's a regular person with bread bags on her shoes but regular people need more than bread bags and it's all insanely popular with the american people. >> joan let me ask you, right away we see them go back and do things that just to me smacks of the ultimate trying to be disrespectful. the speaker, john boehner, inviting prime minister of israel benjamin netanyahu, to address the congress about new sanctions on iran, which breaks all protocol. usually the head of state invites the head of state.
>> it's really shocking. i mean i'm not that old but as far as i know, it's unprecedented and it is a kind of disrespect that i just cannot imagine a democratic speaker, nancy pelosi inviting a head of state to address the congress under george w. bush. i mean my brain just won't even get around that idea that she would show any president that kind of disrespect. so when i heard this i wasn't sure it was true. i really -- it really is that bad. >> well i can say this as i've said throughout the last several years, it's one thing to disagree with the president, it's another thing to undermine a presidency. if you believe in the republic why would you do anything that would desecrate the highest officer in the land. congresswoman karen bass and joan walsh, thank you both for your time tonight. >> thanks for having us on. straight ahead, what republicans stood for last night. and it wasn't much.
plus a major controversy erupts in the sports world. did the patriots cheat to get into the super bowl? and is joe biden ready for a 2016 run? wait until you hear what he's saying. and hillary clinton's putin impersonation. who knew she was ready for "saturday night live." it's all ahead. please stay with us. we come by almost every day to deliver your mail so if you have any packages you want to return you should just give them to us i mean, we're going to be there anyway why don't you just leave it for us to pick up? or you could always get in your car and take it back yourself yeah, us picking it up is probably your easiest option it's kind of a no brainer
because i won both of them. >>
and our "politicsnation" social media community was all over this today. fergi wrote, "oh my gosh the state of the union speech was awesome. the look on boehner's face the entire evening was priceless." judith says, "very well done. he can think on his feet." coming up we'll talk about the significance of his response. but please keep this conversation going on our facebook page or tweet us @politicsnation. because i make the best chicken noodle soup. because i make the best chicken noodle soup. because i make the best chicken noodle soup. for every way you make chicken noodle soup, make it delicious with swanson®. you owned your car for four years. you named it brad. you loved brad. and then you totaled him. you two had been through everything together.
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we've heard a lot of talk from republicans that they want a compromise. but their actions seem to say the opposite. just check out how they
responded to the president at last night's state of the union. >> in the past year alone, about 10 million americans gained the security of health coverage. >> 10 million more people insured. but speaker boehner doesn't think that's the reason to clap. and that wasn't all. >> this congress still needs to pass a law that makes sure a woman is paid the same as a man for doing the same work. >> speaker boehner won't applaud equal pay either. and his members all stayed in their seats. what about minimum wage? >> you truly believe you can work full time and support a
family on less than $15,000 a year? try it. if not, vote to give millions of the hardest
working people in america a raise. >> a huge cheer from democrats and the president's cabinet. while republicans just stood in their shoes. but even that wasn't the worst disgrace that we saw last night. one of the first lady's guest was an undocumented college student who is benefiting from the president's executive action on immigration and republican congressman steve king sent out this tweet about her. "obama preverts prosecutorial discretion by inviting a deportable to sit in a place of honor at the state of the union with first lady." that kind of smear has no place in our politics. the american people don't want insults. they want solutions.
and instead of sitting on their hands, republicans should be reaching out across the aisle. joining me now is congresswoman january schakowski. how can they allow that in the party and then claim that they want to work on issues like immigration? >> well two things. first of all, steve king is notorious for that sentiment. of course this young woman was what we called a dreamer. she was given protection against deportation, allowed to give a driver's license deferred action on deportation in this country. but number two, this really is
the republican policy because they offer it and passed an amendment to the homeland security bill that actually would have rolled back this deferred action for our young people who came here as children with no choice of their own and have really grown up as americans and representing the view of the majority of the republicans who voted for that amendment. >> congresswoman, help me out here. there were two official responses from the gop to the state of the union. and one was in spanish, the other in english. in the spanish language response the congressman said that the party would work to quote, create permanent solutions for our immigration system. in the english language version, nothing on immigration. i mean was it just lost in translation? >> oh no.
joni ernst who gave the official -- there were about five relies. >> this was the same speech. one in english and one in spanish. >> and reported to be the exact translations. but joni ernst left those words out but in the spanish version they talked about as if they wanted to do something about immigration reform. and how much more cynical can you get than that? they wanted to actually tell something that was just not true. the republican party is so far from wanting to do anything about immigration but they wanted to pander to the special language listeners. >> now, some of the republicans who responded last night were actually talking about fairness and income inequality and struggling americans. take a listen to this. >> we see our neighbors agonize over stagnant wages and lost
jobs. >> income inequality is worsened under this administration and tonight president obama offers more of the same policies policies that have allowed the poor to get poor and the rich to get richer. >> so apparently they want to talk about it but they don't want to do anything about it like voting for minimum wage. >> exactly. the nerve of them to say that it's because of president obama whose policies they defied at every single turn. anything that would lift people out of poverty that would bolster the middle class they were opposed to. despite them the economy has begun to take off and wages are even beginning to creep up a bit. but they have been against all of the policies and, of course when he presented some ideas last night, instead of offering any ideas of their own, they said no. no no and no. >> i'm out of time but i want to
mention, i read an op-ed that you wrote about raising the millionaire tax. >> yes. there are tax brackets leading up to $400,000 and nothing after that. so if you make $400 million, you're still in the same tax bracket as someone who makes 400,000. yes, reverend there are people who make $1 billion a year in the united states of america and they should pay a higher tax. >> congresswoman schakowsky thank you for your time tonight. >> thank you so much. the controversy over the super bowl. did the team cheat on its way to the big game. and comments from vice president biden leaving the door wide open for 2016. but first, the flub by senator cruz that he didn't want you to see. that's next. meet the world's newest energy superpower. surprised?
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it's time for reverend al's prompter tips. >> senator ted cruz gave his own state of the union response last night. and it didn't go so well. >> and yet today, medium incomes have stagnated for over a decade. >> let me start over. >> tonight, america saw a powerful demonstration. >> senator cruz had a little trouble with the speech but, don't worry, senator, trust me it happens. we all know i've had my share of prompter issues. right? >> republicans are mad because the tea party has been targeted by the -- excuse me. the irs. all republicans want to do is
spout conspiracy -- i'm sorry. oh, i'm sorry. excuse me. conspiracy theories. >> that's enough of that. so senator cruz let me offer some help. some teleprompter tips. tip number one, take it in stride. mistakes happen but it's always better to just keep going. and we all know you like to read. it might not be green eggs and ham but for number two, always have a hard copy of your script in hand. and i'm on live where you take your speech. last night, you taped it so here's tip number three and it's a basic one. make sure you upload the right clip to youtube. but you know what else you should start looking over? the rest of the speech. >> the president tried to paint
a a r. so rosy picture. >> let me start over. >> i guess 58 straight months of private sector job growth is doom and gloom for the economy? and i guess the uninsured rate at a record low is a train wreck? and that unconstitutional amnesty is actually a very constitutional executive action helping nearly 5 million people. does senator cruz think we wouldn't notice his policy flubs are far worse than his video flub? my response to that is right in that prompter. it says we got you. wait. let me start over. we got you again. you listen. you laugh. you worry. you do whatever it takes to take care of your family. and when it's time to plan for your family's future we're here for you. we're legalzoom, and for over 10 years we've helped
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cheat to get in the big game? it's known as deflate-gate. they are accused of taking air out of the footballs in the game against the colts. espn reports that 11 out of the 12 footballs were two pounds of air pressure short of the league's standing. some sports analyst say a deflated ball is easier to grip especially in the rain. the nfl tells us their review is continuing and they will provide an update as soon as possible. patriots' coach bill belichick says he's cooperating with the investigation but that investigation continues and there are many questions left unanswered. who did it who ordered it and who might have known about it? joining me now is randall hill
and huffington post sports columnist jordan schultz. thank you for your time tonight. if true is this cheating? >> you know it's really strange but it kind of reminds me of back in the day with watergate, you know the patriots are going to win the game anyway just like nixon is going to win so why do we stoop to these levels? >> obviously the greatest nfl player ever tweeted -- greatest player ever tweeted this. 11 of 12 balls underinflated. can anyone spell cheating? >> without a doubt, that's definitely an added advantage for the receivers and for the quarterbacks and it's going to waken some of the eyes who gambled on this game legally and
illegally. it's going to have people right the wrong. >> i asked tom brady about this controversy monday morning before the espn report came out and listen to what he said. >> some reports post-game last night that the league is looking into that the patriots, your team, were deflating the balls within the game. have you heard about this story? do you know the story i'm talking about? >> no, i don't. >> would you care to tell me if you were deflating balls then? >> no. i have no idea. >> did you get the sense that you were able to grip the ball better than the colts last night? [ laughter ] >> would you care to weigh in on that? >> i think i've heard it all at this point. oh god. >> we were trying to figure out whose job it is to take the air out of the ball. i'm pretty sure it's jonathan
kraft. >> nobody's. >> jordan your reaction? >> listen bill belichick has been in the news about this before when you look at spy-gate and defensive signals, this hurts the legacy of him. it does not hurt the legacy of tom brady. he's been to a record six super bowls. it's really upsetting because it does impact the integrity of the game. he said the impact of a deflated ball is really not much. it's a personal preference. it's worth noting that andrew luck had his own set of balls. >> i was surprised to learn that both teams use different balls. how did this come about? >> there was an interception and the linebacker and the colts something wasn't right the way that he was able to make that play. and it's ironic because it wasn't a new england touchdown. the super bowl is where each
team using the same 12 balls. so it is worth noting that. but i think the bigger question here is roger goodell, what is his responsibility and he wants to be the hammer. this is a time to lay a suspension down. i don't think it's going to happen before the super bowl but at some point bill belichick will be suspended with his draft. >> when you talk about -- you brought it up correctly. there are 12 balls on each side. the fans don't know the offense have their balls on each side and then there's a kicking ball. some of the players have come back and said this is not necessary, when you talk about the integrity of the game just go out there and catch a ball, whether it be all the same balls, all deflated properly. there's no call for this. especially in today's age and with the technology the way it is now. >> when you were playing, have you ever heard anything about this?
>> it does happen things like this do happen and you try to play by the rules. you want to play by the rules because you have the fans watching the game and it's all about the integrity of the game. i was a character on the field but i was trying to play within the rules. and playing with deflated balls, no way, because i had dan marino throwing me the ball. >> after the ray rice incident the nfl doesn't need another controversy. >> no. especially after what was one of the best games in history, seattle and green bay. you go into the super bowl with this, this is the last bit of negative pr that the league would want. that's why goodell has a responsibility to do something right for the rest of the league. >> this is an ongoing investigation. we'll certainly be watching it and jordan schultz and randal
hill don't worry, i've been called a character before. something tells me we'll both be all right. >> yes, sir. >> thank you for your time tonight. >> thanks for having me. coming up president obama's drop the mike moment. what can we expect to hear in the next two years? is joe biden gearing up for a presidential run even if hillary gets in? and speaking of hillary, who is she impersonating today? conversation nation is next. push your enterprise and you can move the world. ♪ ♪ but to get from the old way to the new you'll need the right it infrastructure. from a partner who knows how to make your enterprise more agile, borderless and secure. hp helps business move
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[ applause ] >> jonathan that was a comeback to remember. what do you think? are we seeing the president break loose a little? >> break loose a little? man, he is off the chain. look, my favorite part was not just the i want both of them it was the quick turn after he said it. i mean that was so cutting, it's fantastic. >> and then the pause and the smile. midwin? >> absolutely. one of the things i love about it is it's accurate. that's why -- >> it wouldn't have had the punch if it wasn't accurate. >> i think that's why it drew the applause that you heard. people recognize that this is a president who is comfortable in his space, in his skin and he you know, rightfully so shows that we have come a long way in the past six years and we'll all recall in 2006, 2009 the sky
was falling. the economy was not doing well at all. it was undeniable that we are clearly better off than we were six years ago. >> but julie, and i also think -- i was sitting at this table when i was watching it in the studio last night. i also think it was because the republicans was using a line that he was saying to try and get a little dig at him, clapping that he wouldn't be running again and he turned it up on its own head. i think that's what made it more of a poignant moment. >> president obama is a chess player in the sense that he knows what moves are ahead. he knows when he says that line that republicans are going to make a comment and he nailed it. i can say that president obama has a straight mike drop moment and he does such a great job. >> and it wasn't the first time we've seen him disrespected. >> right. >> we are talking about the state of the union and they call themselves collectively on these -- at least a large number
of them. he turned it around and those of us that have been in private meetings with him, and you have jonathan, he has a sharper wit than most people know. the whole world saw it last night. >> that was at the beginning of his term and he turned the other cheek on that. >> right. >> last night, another zinger came at him and he smacked it right back. >> full force. >> and i think that a lot of his supporters and just general americans like that because it was an unnecessary use of applause because he was making a point and then i think that was his drop mike moment. >> that's right. i think in the past he has often come under fire for being sort of reserved and not sort of reacting when he rightfully should react. timing is on his side and oftentimes people say he doesn't
act when he should be aggressive and that's why everybody loved this. like you said it was a drop the mike walk off the stage moment. >> it deflates the jeers. >> let me go on to vice president biden. he's making news of his own this morning. he made the morning rounds stumping the policies that the president laid out last night. but might he be stumping for himself soon? >> secretary clinton is lining up staff and support. is there any chance that you're going to challenge her? >> yes. there's a chance. but i haven't made up my mind about that. we have a lot of work to do between now and then. secretary clinton is a really competent and capable person and a friend. the person who is going to be the next president of the united states is the one who is going to be able to articulate the clearest vision to the american people. i don't think you have to make up your mind until the summer. i think there's a -- i think this is wide open on both sides.
>> julia, this got my attention. could he challenge hillary clinton? >> oh, absolutely. i think it's funny that we're all shocked about the announcement. he's the sitting vice president. we shouldn't be shocked that he is going to run and he has the name recognition. he could push things forward over the next year and things could take shape, take place. >> jonathan, if he runs he's got a gap to close because according to the recent washington post poll your paper, clinton was the clear democratic front-runner with 61%. biden was at 14% and elizabeth warren at is 3 and bernie sanders at 4. how does he make up that gap? >> it's not a gap. it's a chasm. most people don't know who joe
biden is. what we're seeing is an enthusiastic chasm between himself and hillary clinton. they both ran for president in 2008. clearly senator clinton, secretary clinton went a whole lot farther than he did. and i think there's just a thirst and a hunger particularly within the democratic party base for her to run again. one, because half of the base of the party thinks that she lost last time and folks want a woman to get the nomination and to take the white house. >> if he runs though what will he do to the party? if you have a hillary versus biden in the primary, what would that do to the primary? >> it would be interesting to see if he fractures the party. as a sitting vice president, is he the heir apparent and who will president barack obama endorse? hillary clinton or joe biden. i think that's one of the reasons your question is -- >> we know the answer to that
question, i think. >> i think the american public is just like i don't know. you know? and i think that's why your question bodes well. it's true. is this something that could fracture the democratic party. >> everyone stay with me. when we come back hillary clinton, the impersonator. that's next. ♪ with the incredible fuel efficiency of 38 miles-per-gallon highway you can feel like royalty in the nissan altima. now, get great offers on the 38 mpg highway nissan altima. nissan innovation that excites.
we're back with our panel. i want a show of hands. who here eats while driving the car? >> food? in my car? >> in the back of a taxi? >> you may find yourself slapped with a ticket for distracted driving. that's what happened to madison turner who was ticketed for eating a cheeseburger while driving. >> the officer said to me that i wasn't speeding or drivinger erratically. i was extremely careful and did not get a bit of mustard on my shirt. >> midwin legal or out of line? >> i think it's out of line. i would understand why he would want to give a ticket to someone distracted. when you're operating a motor vehicle, obviously you have to make sure that you're abiding by the rules and not distracted. but the problem is, this becomes
a slippery slope thing. if you're going to ticket someone for eating while driving, what if they are admonishing a child, what if a woman is applying makeup? at what point does this stop is the problem. and was the person truly distracted? >> but you raised your head. maybe you're a little biased midwin. >> i raised my hand this way. >> a law may be ticketed a woman putting on makeup while driving, that should be a ticketable offense. >> women know how to multitask. >> because i know how to multitask. that's how. >> let me move on to hillary clinton, julia. we all know comedians love impersonating her. >> thank you for coming. i love your outfit.
>> well, i love your outfit but i do want the earrings back. [ laughter ] >> do i really laugh like that? >> but today the tables were turned at a speech in canada clinton was asked if she had plans for 2016 and instead of answering she did a vladimir putin impersonation. >> if for some reason you decided to be leader of the united states or actually run for that because there is a process. >> yes. there's a process. >> and you got elected and people said you know what -- >> you can imagine the conversation with putin, prime minister after he was president and then one minute said vladimir, do you think you would like to be a president again? i think i would, actually. why don't we just announce it. we'll tell demetris that he can
be president. >> jewelulia how do you rate her president putin? >> i think it's lighthearted and fun. she's known for being more stiff and not as fun and i like it. >> people said it sounded like she was impersonating bill clinton. >> exactly. i think her putin impersonation needs improvement but showing her light side her funny side which, again, you get to see her real personality, that's her. she's a fun, lighthearted person who is quick with a joke great sense of humor but her i am persian nation impersonation skills needs some work. >> she has a sense of humor and she's on top of what other world leaders are doing or what have you. i don't have a problem with it at all. >> i have to go.
i wonder if putin liked the impersonation. when we come back, five years ago today our tollpolitics changed forever. we're following the money. next. natural gas producer... and we could soon become number one in oil. because hydraulic fracturing technology is safely recovering lots more oil and natural gas. supporting millions of new jobs. billions in tax revenue... and a new century of american energy security. the new energy superpower? it's red, white and blue. log on to learn more. they're still after me. get to the terminal across town. are all the green lights you? no. it's called grid iq. the 4:51 is leaving at 4:51. ♪ they cut the power. it'll fix itself. power's back on.
five years ago today the supreme court handed down a decision in the citizens united case dramatically changing the political landscape. >> the u.s. supreme court today overturned laws on the books for nearly a century and ruled that corporations can spend freely now on political campaigns. those who liked this decision say it's a victory for free speech. those who don't say campaigns will now be drowning incorporate cash and influence. >> the critics have been proven right. this chart shows outside spending in midterm elections since 1990. look how it exploded in 2010
when the citizens united decision was made. in presidential elections, the numbers are even worse. outside spending exploded to just over $1.2 billion in the last election. and look at this. last year the top 100 donors to super pacs spent almost as much as all 4 poen 75 million small donors combined. 100 people spending as much as millions. conservatives claiming they don't like activist judges until the judges make decisions they agree with. until those judges tap campaign finance laws or cut the voting rights act. we must fight this battle on the bench and at the ballot box. that's why we must vote and come out. we cannot let money dominate american politics.
it is anti-thetical. thanks for watching. i'm al sharpton. "hardball" starts right now. obama shoots for the history books. let's play "hardball." ♪ good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. like a ball player shooting from beyond the three-point line president obama gave it his best for history. he laid out his legacy what he believes he's done and still wants to do with the time left with what power he can send to his successors to do. well, we know some of it the historic economic recovery since w's financial disaster in 2008, the health care program,