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tv   British Election Party Leaders Debate  CSPAN  April 2, 2015 3:00pm-5:01pm EDT

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you could go online and read the joint agreement at c-span.org. it will be linked up there shortly more comments and calls tomorrow morning. we will take you live next to the u.k. for that debate on the upcoming election. capacity city proud of its heritage, at night the remarkable political debate and the closeness general election. seven party leaders go face to face live in the itv party debate. [applause]
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>> good evening. here in the studio's tonight are seven party leaders with different visions for the future of our country. over the next two hours they will debate head to head in front of her studio audience here tonight. tonight we give out some of the biggest -- we get at the questions are part of the election. the main parties in scotland england are all represented tonight. the leaders are natalie bennett nick clegg nigel berridge of the u.k. independent pardon, edward miliband, nicholas sturgeon of the scottish national party, and david cameron for the conservatives. [applause] our questions will focus on the big political issues we all caps
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off and effect every day life. you can get instant analysis is going to our website. if you want to comment it is #leaders debate. the order in which they go have been decided. first, natalie bennett, your opening statement. natalie: oh -- biggest -- big bonuses were inevitable. they were not. you all deserve better. let's put principles and values first. that is why i got into politics. the dream party is determined to not take the workers pay for the errors of the bankers. we're committed to returning to
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the founding principles, no private money going into private coffers. we know we must take real action on climate change. the biggest threat a thing as all. other parties trade in fear. fear of immigrants, demonizing people on benefits. but to build a decent, humane society we start with help. vote for change, vote for me. >> thank you. now we go to nigel farage. nigel: they may look different but all are the same. all six of for britain's membership of the european union. as a consequence, all of them support open-door immigration. is it any wonder the trust in politics is broken down to the extent it has? } -- i represent the u.k. and we believe this country should be a
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self-governing nation. we believe we are getting to do that. we believe this is depressed the wages, made buying houses are youngsters very difficult. made it tough to get an appointment and not being different countries. we have a positive alternative. let's have revealed europe. but make involved -- laws. let's take back control our own quarter so we can choose the quantity and quality of two comes to britain. by doing that we will give you working people and even break. deputy prime minister clegg: i think it is pretty obvious no one standing there will win the election outright. we'll have to choose who will have to work with who. i am not going to pretend everything ok, although the country is in a lot better shape than five years ago. i will not even pretend i have not made the. what you will get from me and from level -- liberal democrats
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is this, the grit and resilience to finish the job of balancing -- balancing the books. i will always act responsibly. i will never let anyone else are of money we don't have an jeopardize your jobs and the economy. about all, i will always act fairly. i will not let anyone else impose ideological cuffs on your house is old and will always serve the whole of the country. not just parts but the whole of the united kingdom. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, >> this is a chance to make scotland's better. that is why my message to people watching in england and northern ireland is one of friendship. i will not pretend i do not want
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scotland to be independent, i do but as long as stalin remains part of the westminster system that s&p will work to work with those like-minded to deliver change. like many of you we want alternative to the pain of austerity, and and to the tax and hope of privatization. we believe this scarce resources of our country should be invested in the future of our children, not in nuclear weapons. this is a vote to make scotland's voice heard. this will also be a voice for news and progressive politics at westminster are all of us. >> five years ago this country was on the brink and some of the biggest budget deficits anywhere in the world. for the past five years we have been working with the british people for long-term economic land, and that plan is working. almost 2 million more in work.
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it is a balance plans so we have invested in nhs and reducing the deficit but we've cut taxes for 30 million working people. the plan is working because last year we had the fastest growing economy at of any of the major western countries. tonight you will hear a lot of people claiming a lot of things but please remember these are the same people that claimed if we followed the plan unemployment would go up, the deficit would not come down, the economy would not grow in public services would be destroyed. they were wrong then, and they are now. the choice of the election is sticking with the plan that is working or going back to borrowing and spending that got us back -- that got us into the mess in the first place. britain can do some much better than that. leanne: i am speaking to everyone back home in wales tonight. i understand all too well the
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difficulties that have been faced by our communities in recent years. you tell me that jobs and services have been cut to the bone and they can be cut no more. we offer an alternative, hope for the people -- young people for thriving and successful communities. we can win for wales, but we can only do that with you are support. i am asking you to support plan committee, the party of wales to make our communities as strong as they can be. please support to make it the party of westminster. >> here is what i believe, britain succeeds when working people succeed. that is not the way it has been
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for five years. for five years wages have not kept up with bills. the nhs has been going backwards. our young people have been fearing they will have a worse life and their parents. it does not have to be this way. if i am prime minister, i will raise the minimum wage to eight pounds per hour and the reward -- and we will reward hard work again. if i am prime minister, i will reward doctors and nurses. if i am prime minister, i will be the future for all of our young people. cutting the tuition fee from 9000 to 6000 pounds and cut the deficit every year and balance the books. some people will tell you tonight this is as good as it gets for britain. i say britain can do so much better than it has done over the past five years. >> party leaders, thank you very much for your opening statement tonight.
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our audience will put their questions directly to the leaders. each will have one minute to answer before we opened things up for a free-flowing debate. our first question comes from johnny cheetah. >> as a 17-year-old student of politics, how do each of the party for leaders -- party leaders be able to keep the promise without raising certain taxes or making vast cuts to vital public services yet complex i think it is all about family. that is why i do not think you should be faced with the start choice of either cutting too much, david cameron's plan is for 50 billion pounds of cuts way beyond what is needed or borrowing too much. they want to borrow 70 more than necessary. it is a balance, and it does mean you need to reduce bending,
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but you also need to make the wealthiest to pay a bit more to balance the books. that is the way you can balance the books, do it fairly and then put money into public services. perhaps most especially the nhs because it does mean more money for the aging population. the democrat plan will cut less dense and -- less than conservatives and borrow less than laborers. prime minister cameron: we have a plan that is working. we have almost 2 million people back to work. i think what is absolutely crucial here is recognizing what our plan involves is balance. we will go on investing in the nhs every year as we have done under this government under the last parliament. we will find savings of one out of every 100 pounds the government spends.
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you need to do that for two more years just as we're done for the past five years. the alternative is putting out taxes. i do not want to do that. i think if we go back to the spending and the debt, all the things that got us into a mess in the first place we would not help working people, we would hurt working people. that is what labor did last time, and we must not let it happen again. leanne: under our plan the deficit would be cut from 90 billion to 30 billion by 2020. we selling -- no reason to put arbitrary deadlines on cutting the deficit. the austerity measure failed and told the debt would be eliminated, yet debt has gone up. we have seen all of these cuts with so much pain for so little game. the banks have had to bail out. time now or the people to have a
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bailout in time to invest in public services and job creation and to see an end to austerity cuts. >> the question is right. this coalition was put together to reduce the annual deficit to zero. that is why they got together. it is still running at 90 billion sterling every year. more remarkably is the national debt, which has been going on for hundreds of years. in this five years the national debt has doubled from 850 billion to 1.5 trillion. we need to make cuts and there are places we can start. we can easily cut 10 billion pounds per year from the foreign aid budget. another 10 billion by not taking to brussels every single day. we can and vanity projects that will only benefit a tiny number of people, this saving the parliament 4 billion per year and we need to revisit the
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formula because english taxpayers are getting a raw deal to say 5 billion per year in doing that. >> thank you very much indeed. nigel: we will cut the balance and will do it in a error and better way then tried over the past five years. david camera promise to eliminate the deficit and he failed. we will have fair taxes and reduced -- reverse the tax cuts for millionaires. 63,000 pounds for every billionaire and bring. secondly, common sense spending reduction to outside key areas like education and health. spending will fall. thirdly, we will do something else. that's not just as bat for people that has also meant government has not had the tax revenue coming in. that is why this government failed on the deficit.
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what we will do is by boosting the living standard, the third part of the plan to get the deficit down and balance the books. a fairway and better way for our country. natalie: i think what we are offering is not cuts. we are offering the reversal of austerity, investing in your future and the future of everybody in the room. what we have been doing in looking at the deficit is the long way around. we of been -- have been slashing away of public services. probably near you there is a children's center or library near you closed. think of a children's center. she used to be providing an essential public service to the community, paying tax and national insurance. she had a small amount of income to's and in the community. now that essential service is gone. everybody is much power.
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what we are saying is we knew a to raise taxes on those that are currently not paying their share. multinational companies in particular if they pay their share in the world richest country we can afford to have a decent society and a call to have decent public services. nicola: cutting the deficit is important. it should be a means to people living better. austerity is pushing people into poverty. it is holding back economic growth. when economic policy is doing all of that, that policy needs to change. i do not agree with the cuts proposed. we should look at the spending increases over the next parliament. it will take long -- slightly longer to eliminate completely but the deficit with completely
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to fall -- would continue to fall. that alternative plan would mean we have resources to invest in infrastructure and skills and innovation and things to get the economy growing. that kind of alternative plan must be better than a blamed commitment to austerity that does not take any account of the damage being done to our society. >> you have major opening statements in the first questions. time to open the floor to contest each other's arguments. deputy prime minister clegg: my question is for david cameron. he is just said he wants to raise the course. remarkably the conservative party has said they will not ask the richest in society to make a single extra penny of contribution for balancing the books in the tax system. they want to impose a driven cut to the school. when i hear the conservatives
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talk about the choice, just imagine the chaos in people's lives, the people who and nhs do not know where to find the money. that is why johnny is right. you need to take a balanced approach. you need to reduce ending but also asked the richest to make the sacrifice. prime minister cameron: that gets wrong about the plane. this is part of the balance plan that involves putting our money into nhs and cutting taxes. here is the point, we have to understand what the deficit matters and why we got here. the problem with the real choices with ed miliband who thinks the government did not taxed too much, spent too much and borrow too much. if you do not understand the mistake of the past, you cannot provide the leadership for the future. edward: david, you just said you
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were tackling tax avoidance. let's look at the reality on this here yet you have not acted on the cap haven. you have not acted on hedge fund . we show you how you can raise over a billion pounds for the nhs. 20,000 more nurses. 3000 more midwives. you have to ask yourself at home, why want david cameron act on those hedge funds cap they fund his party and will not have the leadership to tackle -- prime minister cameron: once again he is wrong. just this week he introduced a tax to go after the companies that make money in britain and do not pay taxes in britain. eris what he is not telling you because he does not support any of this ending deficiencies, he wants to make a very big cut put up taxes and cut your take going into the monthly payslip and taking your money out because he thinks he can spend
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that money better than you. that would be a great mystic for the country. >> they argue when they have been handing glove imposing austerity on the country, he is said in opening remarks everyone apart from him had been true over the past five years. that is actually not the case. he missed the target by 150 billion pounds. his policies are pushing children into poverty. one million additional children going to be living in this poverty by 2020. what i want to do, i'm back using the tax and invest in the children, nothing new there weapons. this country cannot afford more cut in the next parliament. we need to see spending rise. >> i am hearing half of the
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panel think they have no problems with the debt at all and the other half thing they have been prudent with spending. bending got completely out of control under labor and many of the coalition would bring it back under control. we had doubled the national talks of pledge in the past five years. we have a massive problem here. it seems to me we have run a miss. what we are done is maxed out credit cards. we have a dental -- dreadful death program. i do not think making this is still necessary the best solution to our problem. it comes back to the simple issue of how you balance the books but do it fairly. i do not believe you do it by just letting the very richest off scott free. their plans do not involve a
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single extra contribution through the time system. i do not believe it is fair to do with the labor party wants to do which is increased borrowing. >> you have done it so far balancing the books on the back of the poor. 79 million people -- >> 79,000 people -- >> 30% of young people -- >> thank you. edward: you we hear lots of mongering tonight. i think it is a big decision for our country. david cameron needs to double the cuts in funding next year. wants to double the cut in ending next year. is that really a balanced plan? the nhs has gone backwards under
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david cameron. i think it is much better to put it on the back of the tax payers. >> there have been two issues covered here. one is the issue of the debt. it is worth saying over the past 100 years half of it has been a higher bid to gdp ratio. no one worried about it much. the rest in you are borrowing. if you are borrowing for the rent we so desperately need, you know you will get a return far into the future. that asset is there for the future generations. the second point about the nature of the cap, this has been born overwhelmingly by the most vulnerable in the society. 8000 of the most disabled people in our society support -- are
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stashed away. we have to be a humane, fair and decent society in support the most vulnerable. >> the truth about this is we'll of cut the deficit of half. only if we stick to the plan. the plan that is working. it is worth remembering as we debate cuts, why did these have to happen? i have the truth about cuts here. this is a copy of the letter that labor left in the treasury when we arrived in government five years ago amanda said, i am sorry, we have run out of money. that is the truth of what happened. we have to make the decision because the british economy was on the brink. people were buried on whether we would be able to pay the debt. the top 20% have paid more than the remaining 80% put together. my fear is if they got empowered they would do it all over again.
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>> isn't that the truth? prime minister cameron: we have cut the deficit -- nigel: there you go again. you cannot talk about the present or the future so you talk about the past. people want to know what we will do for them in the next five years. let's talk about the future. let's talk of the choices are working families in the future. will we have favor -- fiarer taxes, andfairer taxes, reduce spending? prime minister cameron: we will keep on with this reduction in unemployment that is 2 million more people in work. we are going to do it with the welfare and the tax. >> david cameron, thank you. nigel. nigel: how can they believe your
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promises yucca you have a lot in the government to eliminate your deficit. running a 90 billion sterling. prime minister cameron: we will find one pound of every 100 the government ends and saying that in each of the next two years and you that. combined with the extra taxes in terms of tax avoidance and tax evasion we will eliminate the deficit. we will work into words -- leanne: the deficit can be cut but setting arbitrary deadlines is it was on civil. labor has voted or more on rarity. they voted for another 30 billion pounds worth of cut. in the bounties where i live, we have yet to recover from the recession before last, let alone this one. your party represents many areas
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of wales at all different levels. do you accept you have failed people in wales you we represent some of the poorest communities in all of the eu, and you are party is presiding over those communities. deputy prime minister clegg: no, i don't. let me tell you the differences. he refuses to acknowledge -- to tax them is the answer. in that he chooses to keep the bedroom tax. our young people back to work. i will make their choices, much fairer than him. he wants to go much further on the deficit much further on spending cuts, and that will mean not just the rebalance the books that go further. that will mean a crushing act. >> let me ask you a question -- leanne: our funding has been disadvantage in wilson's 1998. when your party was in power and had an opportunity to thought that out you did not do it.
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1.2 billion pounds in wales. if you get into government will you get to billion pounds to wales? >> you are quite right to wales negotiated very fast deal in 1970. this has to be rebalance. english taxpayers are a bit udall with a much of their money going to a more and no university tuition. there needs to be a rebalancing. in the future scotland should receive less money per capita than it currently does. >> they have paid more tax in every single year for the past 34 years. the western to ed miliband, it talks the language about austerity but only a few weeks and it has been through the house of commons with nick lake and david cameron to vote for 30 billion pounds of cuts over the
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net two years. i take a different view to that. i do not believe you can some a cut your way out of the deficit. i think david cameron is the proof. we need to grow our way out of the deficit. austerity has held back economic growth. let these modest spending increases -- why did you vote 30 billion pounds of cap? uts? prime minister cameron: two weeks ago we had a vote against austerity -- you have a plan to cut six and pounds in scotland to the economy plan. you need to explain what that will mean for the people. >> absolutely right.
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>> you have a choice between austerity heavy and austerity like, and i think we have been talking -- david cameron has been talking a lot about the job he created. let's ago that state of employment in david -- in britain today. more than 25 workers are on a less than living wage. people are being forced into employment not because they choose but because they have no other choice. 80% are living in poverty.
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that is just simply wrong. more burden on some of the richest people through having a stamp duty on expensive properties. but what i am hearing in this debate where is i want to say one out of every 100 pounds the government spends are not putting up taxes. what i am hearing is more debt and taxes, a lot more to enforce taxes. -- and a lot more taxes. >> you are proposing a reduction of wealth billion cuts and welfare taxes.
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let's in the last parliament we found 21 billion the savings and welfare, because everybody knows welfare was overblown and needed to be properly dealt with. what is the alternative to making reductions on wealth? putting of taxes and raising people's pay. let's one million people on disability -->> one million people on disability are going to lose 1100 pounds of their benefit. i want a plan that protects vulnerable. >> i think we should reapply or ties -- rear -- reprioritize government spending. we should focus on the people. and really frankly costing 10 billion per year net members of the european union. these are massive evenings we could make.
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some of the concerns about social funding and everything else, that is not where the cut need to come. let's giving for money away. >> thank you. we want to cut 821% of gdp. increased to eight we need a more secure in table world. that means tackling hunger and disease and human right. that is what the age should be for. >> i have said there will have to be ending production. the areas like nhs and reduction. david cameron has an extreme plan. i am not one to stand on the stage tonight and say they're do not need to be difficult decisions. cuts will have to come, but we can do it in a balanced and fair way. >> accuray much party leaders on the first question of the evening. -- thank you very much. our next western is on the nhs
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to the assembly in wales and northern ireland. this is about the election of the debate at westminster and matters in england. our western comes from carrie kelly. >> as a 63-year-old i have grown up with the nhs and recently retired after working there. my question is this, how will your party insurer long-term funding for the nhs while keeping it as a public service accessible to all ? nigel: like you, i carry about the nhs because i have had so many rates in my life i have needed it far more than most people. when it comes to emergency care, it probably is the best in the world. that does not mean something to not occasionally go wrong. the whole rest of how we find the service with a population rapidly rising and aging is a huge western. we have a big internal debate in
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our party about it. we have decided the best way to do it is run it efficiently, a public service free at the point of access, but to recognize there has been a 48% rope in little management of nhs and 1997. the labour party attempted to privatize the health service. i also do not believe it is work. i put an extra 3 billion pounds in from the eu contributions and would stop attacks on illness by ending hospital party judges. >> this is a really important question. the nhs is the most precious public service we have got. i was health secretary for five years. in scotland we protect the budget of the nhs, and we will always do so. we believe passionately that nhs should always be run as a public service, not for private profit.
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in england we propose in principle. we also oppose the risk and long-term scotland. that is why s&p in the house of commons will take the opportunity to vote again any extension in england. it is one of the reason we see to build progressive alliances. the best thing we can do is to end austerity. you other parties talk about increasing funding. if they tried to do that with ending cuts, they will have to cut even deeper every year. anyone who tells you the welfare budget is good for the nhs is wrong. let's let's austerity and it best in the nhs but i'll -- but without making deeper cuts. >> the nhs was not a huge issue in the 2010 election, but a huge issue now. in 2010 we were well aware of the huge cost and how there was already creeping privatization
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in the nhs. what we have seen since then keeping with the help and social care act has been a race toward setting up structures or privatization. what we say in the green profit is this should have no place in health care. we are not happy with 5% of money that is supposed to be for health care going in profit. we want no percent going in profit. to make nhs more efficient to deal with problems what we need to do is taking the whole market mechanism out of nhs. the select help committee in 2010 costing 10 billion pounds per year. we need to put more money in. we need to look at the structures and a no private poppers. nigel: we are part very strong words about the nhs. we do not need more words, we
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need hard cash. i will give you the precise number. if you can billion pounds by the end of the neck parliament. that is a man who runs nhs england, independent of, has said it needs. the liberal democrats have a plan. unlike the conservatives, we would ask the richest to pay a little extra intact for the nhs. unlike labor, they would be able to put money in nhs because we will get the job done of balancing the books, and then we can invest in the nhs. that is the way to balance the books and invest in nhs. it means 8 billion pounds more here and a billion more in scotland and 450 million -- 450 million more pounds in wales. my challenge is if you love the nhs so much, put the money where your heart is. >> this is probably one of the
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most important contributions of our modern age. based on his scheme founded by people contributing to gather to fund the help they need collectively. the nhs is precious and must be defended against privatization. it is facing to threats, one from continued austerity and cut, and two centralization of labor and wales. we want to recruit and retract -- attract an additional 1000 doctors to bring us to the same level as the rest of the u.k.. at the moment we are way behind. we have fewer doctors than the vast majority of countries in the eu. the nhs needs to be funded through general taxation. edward: like so many people around the country i am deeply concerned about what i see happening in the national health
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service. we see people waiting longer in -- for health results, longer to have an operation. we're got to turn it around. i think it home you to ask where specifically is the money coming from? we will have a mansion tax on the most expensive home. we will get money from the hedge funds. we will get money from the tobacco companies were 2.5 million pounds. that will hire 20,000 were nurses, 8000 were doctors, 5000 health care workers and 3000 more midwives. it is joining up services from home to hospital, taking on the biggest challenger, which is an aging population so people cannot get into the their gp they end up in a nanny. a plan to turn the nhs around. edward: thank you for your incredible service to the nhs.
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you are absolutely right, the most important national institution of public service we have. i will never forget at the data of a death really disabled child what i get every night worrying about his health, i got unbelievable care. i want that were everyone in our country. we've been talking about the difficult decisions we have had to make to turn the economy around. a difficult decision was to find the nhs. that means we have trained 7000 were nurses. 9000 more doctors, and i've also managed to take 20,000 bureaucrats because i want the money spent on patient care. it is key we keep a strong economy in order to fund a strong nhs. i wanted to the nha -- nhs being moved to a much stronger seven-day operation. there is only one group of
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politicians anywhere in the united kingdom who cut the nhs in the past five years and that was the labour party in wales. when you hear ed miliband's promise, think about that. turning to nigel for opening debate. nigel: i want to talk about tourism. lien made the point it was christian the national -- christened the national health service. estimators have cost 2 million pounds per year. i wonder, what the panel agree with me that it needs to be the national health service, a sensible thing if like any other sensible country in the world we say the foreign workers you must have health insurance when nigel: you come here. nigel:--when you come here. natalie: absolutely not. this does not reflect the
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reality. the situation is people come here as immigrants to work or come here to seek asylum as refugees. we have had a really dangerous damaging debate about immigration where it has been fueled by the others. we need to look at the fact that nhs is hugely dependent on foreign-born workers. it could not operate without them. >> thank you, natalie bennett. the long-term funding of the nhs will keeping public service available. edward: of course we have to look at those issues, but are really do not believe that is at the root of all the problems of the national health service. david cameron said he protected the nhs. those at home have to decide whether this is what protection looks like. one million people waited for more than five hours. we are missing the target that accounts for treatment for the first time ever. to add to that, a tent erected
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in the hospital car parking lot to treat people in the united income. i do not believe that is protecting the nhs. plans for the next parliament are even more dangerous. prime minister cameron: let's just take the one example of what we are seeing with cancer. 464,000 per year getting seen and getting examined for cancer than use to happen. our survival rate used to be some of the worst in europe and now some of the best in europe. a strong nhs needs a strong economy. if we go back to labor plans for taxes and debt and spending and welfare, that will affect the nhs. this point about the commitment is important. what i said will find the nhs more every year, the labor view is that is more responsible. the democrat view is not the right response.
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nigel:deputy prime minister clegg: terry asked how we would do this for the aging population. the nhs is under pressure as never before. it was a simple question who has the plan to put 8 billion pounds of additional money? that is what all have been told is required. you will not get it in scotland. they actually reduce money compared to what we've done out of the border. you will only get it if you ask the wealth to pass on additional contribution. this is physical health and the remaining and -- the physical health of nhs. nicola: the nhs budget has increased by 3 million pounds.
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it will go up next year. one thing we have learned is there is not nigel what not vote for. many are things we should tolerate. many people are living longer. new treatments, new technology. first we have to reform. yesterday in scotland, health services are integrated. yes, we have to invest. i think it is right to it that this event reports but this is in england. 9.5 billion pounds and if you follow the plan i am putting forward of modest, fiscally responsible spending increases we can invest more in the health service and do that without cutting welfare. >> health has been used as a political football in order to core point off of each other ahead of the general election. the people that suffer most when that happened are the patient
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and the staff. there are problems in health and england and wales. my view is those problems are exacerbated by cut to social services. they are also exacerbated by privatization. it was the labour party that began the process of privatization in health services. they introduced foundation hospitals as well. my view is the private sector has new role in the public health service. prime minister cameron:nigel: my two sons were born in an nhs half. falling down half. this cut under david cameron are about to go much further. he said he is protected the nhs and said he kept his word. did there have been a whole series of promises in the last
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election two people. no top-down prioritization. you said no going back to the days when you wait hours on end. that is exactly what happened. i do not think they will take you seriously your promises on nhs because you broke the last promises. prime minister cameron: we took 25,000 bureaucrats and put 9000 doctors and 7000 nurses in. he opposes those reforms. presumably he would like to hire the bureaucrats. let me answer terry directly about things we can really do to make a difference with nhs. dementia is a silent isis in the country. we are raising the diagnosis rate. we need to keep going with that. the point about seven day organization, we need to keep going with that. they carry out operations saturday and sunday as much as they do monday through friday. as a result, they have a fantastic service.
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we can improve nhs if we go after things like dementia and public health that put so much pressure on to nhs. >> since you are talking numbers, let's look at the 6 billion pounds. in the end, the privatization is nothing huge damage. what we are doing his racing toward the american health care system, a system that uses twice the percentage of gdp that we use on health care for worse outcomes. the point of really want to pick up is need to think about the nature of the society. we are point going to take pressure off the nhs, we need a healthier society. anchorage bicycling and walking. -- encourage bicycling and walking. deputy prime minister clegg: it is simply not true. it is not the case. but thank you. -- >> thank you.
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deputy prime minister clegg: we legislated to end the sweetheart deal by the labor government. when we took over five years ago , the total amount of nha monday -- many as 4%. it is now percent. i do not call that a great sweeping after privatization but it needs the money, 8 billion, and we need to bring social care and health care together, because we have too many elderly folk and hospital bed. they should be discharged from the hospital but do not have a place to go. nigel: my challenge here was of course ignored. yes, your to put money in an have money something less -- wasted. i mentioned the health care system. i am sure people will be mortified i dare to talk about it. and thousand diagnoses in this country every year for people who are hiv positive.
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there is not a good place or any of them to be, i know. 60% of them are not british nationals. you can go to britain from anywhere in the world and get diagnosed for hiv and get the drugs that cost up to 25,000 pounds per year per patient. i know there are some horrible things happening in many parts of the world, but what we knew to do it but national health service therefore british people and families who have many aces paid into the system for decades. leanne: this is dangerous. it creates stigma to people who are ill. i think you should be ashamed of yourself [applause] . [applause] --i think you should be ashamed of yourself. [applause] nigel: the question is, how do we find the nhs? up to 2 billion pounds per year is being lost on health tourism, surely that is
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-- nicola: when someone is diagnosed with the dreadful illness, my instinct is to treat them as a human being, not consider what country they come from. ed miliband said there should be limits on the privatization of the health care system. i take a different view on that there should be no privatization at the health service. it is far too precious to give it up for private profit. you mentioned 49% of half the beds to be used for the private sector. my message to people in england and northern ireland, the house of commons after the election and you want to roll back to pay the privatization, we will be your ally in doing that. >> five years ago we inherited a situation where the private government had with the 200 80 million pounds on sweetheart deals with private-sector
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contractors, which did not help a single nhs patient. we outlaw that use of public money for private sector contracts, which are only based on price rather than policy. 4% under labor already devoted -- it is simply not the case. edward: you supported the health and social care act as a recipe for privatization. there is a bigger issue for people at on. that is future plans for the nhs . i set out for the money is coming from. david cameron is planning to double the spending cuts next year. think that that would mean not just for nhs for social care. if you cut social care dramatically, you undermine nhs fundamentally because elderly people do not get help in their own home, and up in the half at all in the nhs is creaking at the scene. imagine what it would be like
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with another five years of david -- david cameron. prime minister cameron: ed miliband is scaremongering. for most of us nhs is a service with the families, not a political weapon. we are starting on the first of april a new fund, a better care fund 5.3 billion pounds bringing health and social care together so we can unblock the hospital beds, make sure people get the health and care they need in the community. there was something else we inherited, a culture of cover-up. just 60 miles from where we are is the new stafford hospital. we all remember what we uncovered with the public in irish that elderly people were being left uncared for. the target culture had run rampant. we have changed that in nature more nurses on ward, more doctors in charge and standards of care are going up.
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>> that situation makes it even worse because you have fewer social workers that are effective -- prime minister cameron: i would suggest we need three things to figure the nhs. first, money, 8 billion pounds. secondly, give mental health the same importance and emphasis in the nhs has traditionally given to physical health. third, make sure elderly patients are discharged from hospital's with a social care system that has a place for them to go. >> pick up on the point david cameron made about cover-up. edward: i would say everyone at home use your vote to fight for the future a national health service. in needs to be rescued from you. i have to say, over 14 years the labor government transformed 18
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month waiting to 18 week record and now going backwards under you. you have failed the british people, broken the trust. they believed you. it has gone backwards on your watch. they will not trust you again. prime minister cameron: there are more nurses and doctors and people being treated and that is has never strong economy. he talks about failure. let's remember the failure of the last labour government that bankrupted the country and left us with impossible decisions. the biggest decision was protect nhs to spend more every year. a decision that labor said at the time was irresponsible. we ignored that. we went ahead and invest in as part of the balance plan for our country. edward: people are told will have to decide. i think the nhs is the foundation for working memories. that is my only when working people succeed the britain people succeed. david cameron will tell you he
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wants to congratulate himself and pat himself on the back. your experiences are what you see in the nhs. nigel:atalie: david cameron raise the issue of social care. this is important in its own right. 2 million people aged over 65 who needs social care. 800,000 are not getting any help at all. it is worth thinking for a second about what social care actually is. you may need help getting out of bed and bathing in the morning. you might need help just living your life, and you are not getting the help you need. that is why the party is calling for free social care for over 65 immediate. prime minister cameron: the point about the 5.3 that will help fund the care natalie is talking about, but also, how important it is we have a seven
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day nhs with gp being open 8:00 in the morning until it :00 in the evening because areas of the country were that is already happening, some in greater manchester, we are seeing a lot less pressure on hospitals. all of this has taken the extra resources we put into the nhs because the long-term economic man is working. >> thank you very much indeed. we have come to the end of the debate of the nhs. thank you very much indeed for all of that. we will take a short break now. when we come back, the issue will be immigration. [applause] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2015] >> the u.k. leaders debate continues in about three minutes. during the break we will take a look at president obama's announced from earlier today about a framework for coming together for an agreement with i'm wrongran on the nuclear program.
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the president made his remarks from the rose garden. obama: recall at the time, skeptics argued that iran would cheat and we cannot verify their compliance. the interim agreement would fail. instead, it has succeeded exactly as intended. iran has met all of its obligations. it eliminated its stockpile of dangerous, nuclear material. inspections of their program increased, and we continued negotiations to see if we could achieve a more comprehensive deal. today, after many months of tough principled diplomacy, we have achieved the framework for that deal. it is a good deal. a deal that meets our core
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objectives. this remark would cut off every pathway that iran could take to develop a nuclear weapon. iran will face strict limitations on its program and iran has also agreed to the most robust and intrusive inspections and transparency regime ever negotiated for any nuclear program in history. this deal is not based on trust. it is based on unprecedented verification. many key details will be finalized over the next three months. nothing is agreed to until everything is agreed. here are the basic outlines of the deal that we are working to finalize. first, iran will not be able to pursue a bomb using plutonium because it'll not develop a weapons grade plutonium. the core of its iraq to test reactor -- reactor will be
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dismantled. the field will be shipped -- fuel will be shipped out of iran . they will not build a new heavywater reactor and they will not reprocess fuel from its resisting -- existing reactors ever. second, this deal shuts down around's to a bombed using enriched uranium. iran has agreed that the centrifuges will be reduced by two thirds. they will no longer and rich uranium with its advanced centrifuges for the next 10 years. the vast majority of their stockpile of enriched uranium will be neutralized. today, estimates indicate that iran is only two or three months away from potentially acquiring the raw materials that could be used for a single nuclear bomb. under this deal, ron is agreed that it will not stop while the materials needed -- not
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stockpile the materials needed to build the weapon. for the next decade at least iran would be a minimum of a year away from acquiring enough material for a bomb. >> we show the president's remarks in their entirety at 8:00 tonight on c-span. dr. northwestern england -- back to northwestern england as the debate continues. host: seven party leaders are debating the they can issues of the campaign. viewers elsewhere in the u.k. will also be able to see the debate. time now for our third question which comes from joan richards. >> as a part of europe immigration is inevitable.
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if you were elected, how would you address the issue of immigration? host: thank you very much. ed miliband. mr. milliband: i would change labor approach on immigration because i don't get his prejudice to worry about immigration. i want to explain how we will deal with these concerns. if i am elected, we put in place new rules which say it you come to this country, you want get benefits for at least the first two years. we will also stop the undercutting of wages and conditions that happens so often. employers exploiting migrant labor, not hang the minimum wage, recruiting only from a broad to undercut wages. we have to deal with it and if i am prime minister are, i will.
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if you want a party that will cut britain off from the rest of the world, that is not me. i believe we have to play our role in the world. if you want a party with control and immigration, that is what i offer. host: thank you very much. ms. wood: this will not go along with the scapegoating of migrants. it was not immigrants who caused this economic crisis it was bankers. we should not allow the rhetoric that blames immigrants. there is a reason why there is a strong anti-immigration ceiling and areas --in areas. often, those areas have not shared in the world that has been generated. there are certain skills we need but sadly, the debate around immigration has stopped those
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gaps from being filled. we talked about the nhs. this immigration debate has not helped that problem. it has exacerbated it. ms. sturgeon: we do need strong and effective control and immigration. we need to make sure people don't get away with abusing the system the rest of us pay for. we also need to recognize there are parts of the u.k. that are resting on public services. the answer to that is investing more in public services and forcing 80's of minimum wage, not scapegoating immigrants -- forcing a decent minimum wage, not scapegoating immigrants. i think we need to have a balanced debate. here are some facts we need to keep in mind. eu immigrants are not contributors to public financing. the majority of migrants work.
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the majority of those who don't our students. let's not forget that hundreds of thousands of british citizens go to live in other countries. how would we feel they were spoken about or treated in a way that migrants often are here? let's not duck the issues. let's make sure there is a decent and civilized debate, not one driven by intolerance. prime minister cameron: what we need in our country is to recognize that people who come here and work hard and contribute to our companies and communities, they help make this a great country. we do need immigration that is controlled and fair. and in recent decades, it has been too high and i want to see it come down. we have reduced immigration from outside the eu. inside the eu, not least because we have created more jobs than the rest of the european union put together. immigration has been very high
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so we need to bring that under control. here the proposals i will put in place. if you're coming from the eu, you want to get unemployment benefits. if you have been here for six months and do not have a job, you have to go home. if you come here and work, you have to work for four years before you get out of the system. if you leave your family at him, he won't be able -- at home, you won't be able to send back money to them. mr. clegg: they all agree to be part of the european union. they ask you a question. what can we do as members to control immigration? nothing. the prime minister can talk about benefits. this is not about benefits. this is about numbers. we have a total open door to 10 former communist countries and the eurozone more people are suffering very badly. i don't blame a single migrant
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wanting to better their lives. it is depressed wages that has led to such a crisis in housing. we have to build a new house. one house every seven minutes just to cope with current levels of immigration. we need to change our relationship with europe to one of trade and friendship, take back control of borders, and put in place in australian starport system and 77% of british people want something done. >> i will never spread fear about immigration because i think there is bad and good immigration. in a bad immigration, that needs to be stopped. that is why i have introduced new checks to the board to bear down on immigration, increase the penalties on employers who exploit people from elsewhere. there is also good immigration. we should remain a decent, generous, open hearted nation who welcome people who play by
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the rules, pay taxes help in the nhs. if we turn everyone away, the nhs will collapse overnight. i want britain to be opened for business but not open to abuse. ms. bennett: we celebrated the movement as free people in the eu. many britons have been able to take advantage of that. that is a real plus. if we think about non-eu immigration, what we need is a humane system cannot is not what we have now. take one example. the fact that the court of appeals against defined and refusal, people often victims of torture in their own country. these people eventually say, yes
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you are a refugee after all. when people talk to me up at immigration, they say they are concerned about three things -- low wages, crowded schools and hospitals, and housing problems. all of those are important critical issues. but they are not caused by immigration, they are caused by failures of government policy. host: i will turn to david cameron now. let's pick up on natalie bennett's point that immigration should be celebrated. prime minister cameron: we do have benefits but i think the choice boils down to this -- nigel is saying there is nothing you can do inside the european union so give up and leave. edward seems to say he does not want to renegotiate anything. i say renegotiate, get the changes we need, and put those in a referendum to the british people by the end of 2017. i have sat around that table in
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europe and negotiated for britain. you can get things done. i have set out with i want to get done so we can sort out this immigration issue once and for all. >> mrs. merkel has made it perfectly clear we can negotiate a lot of things but you cannot renegotiate the free movement of people within the european union. that is backed up by the president of the european council. do you accept or not that in your renegotiation, free movement is not up for discussion? prime minister cameron: i don't accept that you give up before you have begun. people said it was impossible, we cut the european budget. i said let's get out of these bailout funds. people said you will never do that. we got out of those greek bailout funds. instead of giving up, let's negotiate. the problem with nigel is, you are a backdoor to a labor
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government which would give us open-door government. mr. milliband: i'm wondering what world you live in. you took -- talk about when negotiating skill and europe. he made a big stand against the president of the european commission. you lost 26-2 because you have no allies. you have marginalized us in your. -- in europe. he failed on promises and he will make mamas is again. i don't think our places out of the european union. i think that would be a disaster for jobs, for families and businesses. let's change europe so what is better for us. mr. clegg: as far as immigration and the eu, i would say, it
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should never be the same as the freedom to claim. that is something we have done. it is a two way street. almost as many britons living elsewhere then there are europeans working here. if you want to make sure our own youngsters get the jobs a lot of people from elsewhere want to get, we have to train them. one of the things i am most proud of over the last five years as we have lost 2 million people -- have 2 million people starting apprenticeships. over half of those are women. we need to train our own youngsters so did they get the jobs they apply for at home. prime minister cameron: there are three sides to this coin. you have to have an education system that turns out junk people that can do the jobs are economy is creating. -- turns out young people.
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it is not simply about what happens in europe. we inherited bogus colleges and the out these is like factories people who could claim benefits on arrival. we have stopped that. we have people appealing against decisions made here. there are changes you can make. ms. wood: diversity is one of our good strength and i can see that in this audience. decisions on immigration should be driven by the economy. the problem we have is that it is leading to some long decisions. one david came to office, he abolished the study works these of. the abolition of that is making it more difficult for our
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universities to attract international students. it means we deprive ourselves of the economic contribution of young foreign students that we have helped to educate here. it makes no sense. changes need to be made in the eu and the best thing to do is to build alliances to make those changes, not at like a petulant schoolchild threatening to leave if you don't get your way. it is better to try to work together. ms. sturgeon: all of this is about pulling out of the eu. i recognize there are many problems in the eu but we benefit from being a member. if that is a referendum, the boat should be taken separately in each of the four countries so that if we are to pull out, it only happens when all four
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countries agree so you don't just have the biggest nation rolling everyone out. ms. bennett: i would partly agree that we need to talk about the nature of the debate. i disagree that this is about economics. it is a debate about human lives. if we look out a particular aspect of our immigration policy now, you have to be -- if you have a non-eu partner, you have to be earning more than 18,600 pounds a year. a judge describe this as unfair and unreasonable. 19,000 britons cannot live in their own country because of that role. syrian refugees -- the u.n. has asked us clearly to take our share of the most vulnerable syrian refugees. you said you are not doing that, we're taking our own program. we have taken 140 three syrian
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refugees. i say, we should be taking our fair share of those most vulnerable syrian refugees. nigel: we should take some refugees from serious. -- syria. what can we do to control immigration? nothing. no one else here would actually admit that. can we get some sense of history? if you go back to the 1990's, net migration was about 40,000 a year. in the 80's, lower. in the 50's, slightly higher. since world war ii come we -- world war ii, we have operated at about 30,000 a year. it is now net 300,000 people a year. it is 10 times anything this country has had to live with since 1945. it means for ordinary people, a
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minimum wage or not very high salaries there wages have been compressed. the people of britain who have paid a high price for the corporate employers -- prime minister cameron:mr. clegg: we are raising the minimum wage. i am married to a foreigner -- let's be openhearted. stop that immigration but don't paint everyone with the same brush. >> how do you control immigration as an eu member? be honest people. we cannot. mr. clegg: the freedom to move around should not be the same as the freedom to claim.
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you seem to imply anyone who is foreign who comes to this country is a menace. we must remain spirited. >> you won't admit the truth. there is nothing we can do. mr. milliband: david cameron said earlier that work pays in our country. rubbish. so many people in our country -- millions of people -- they cannot feed their family, make ends meet at the and of the month. if work is insecure, doesn't pay properly, you don't get the security that working people need. i say we should deal with those. it is a part of this immigration debate. you have to create this for the peoples of britain and that is what i will do. prime minister cameron: we have created 2 million jobs.
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when he was in the, half a million people lost their jobs. nigel, you want to leave the eu. the only way that can happen is by having a referendum. i say stay and fight, get a better deal but hold the referendum. [indiscernible] host: thank you, david cameron. nigel, let's hear the point on syria. prime minister cameron: the most important thing we can do in syria is maintain the fact that we are the second-largest bilateral aid donor helping
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people there to be house clothed. there are 6 million people that are in danger of being refugees. we cannot take all of those people. it make sense to use our aid budget to help them in the region. ms. sturgeon: david cameron is taking us dangerously close to the exit door. i like to issue a challenge tonight. they have spent a lot of time in scotland talking about the u.k. family of nations. will they give a commitment if there is a referendum, no one part of that family of nations will be taken out of europe against its will. will they give a commitment that the votes will be counted in each of the nations? mr. milliband: my priority is
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not to have a referendum. let me explain why. i priority is to tackle the cost of living crisis and build a future for our young people. the british people have a decision to make tonight. david cameron for the next two years deciding to exit the european union one he does not want to do so. i say there is better priorities for our country. mr. hawthorne: in 2012, david cameron was opposed to britain having the eu referendum, saying it was not international interest. the people out there that want a referendum -- mr. clegg: nigel seems to think every problem can be sold on a referendum to europe. it is the world's largest marketplace. 500 million shoppers who buy our
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goods and services. if you do want nigel, to yank ourselves out of the family that makes up the european union, unemployment will go up and i would never endorse an approach which would make our country poor and make people go out of work. i think it is responsible. ms. bennett: you have to be in your late 50's to have had a chance to vote on europe. the green party does support a referendum but we would be campaigning strongly to stay in europe. we believe that europe -- there are certain decisions that should be made at that level like protecting our environmental standards, workers rights, those kinds of decisions. also, what we need to do is have a different kind of europe that is much less centralized, much better for the local communities. ms. wood: i think that the
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rhetoric on immigration has not helped the economic situation and the welsh economy that need filling. the one thing i would agree with nigel on, and i never thought i would say that -- [laughter] ms. wood: you cannot control immigration from inside the eu as a member. you have to accept that people will come here. we have free movement of people. we expect our citizens to be treated well when they moved to other countries and likewise, we mistreat europeans when they come live with us in our communities. >> these actually work rather well. when we were in with countries like france, germany
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netherlands, roughly similar education systems, it did not pose any problems. the problem was irresponsibly we let in 10 former communist entries where the minimum wage is about a 10th of what it is here. if you say to people in poor countries they can move to rich countries, they do. the labor government that it radically wrong on the figures. we now face the potential of a collapse in the eurozone and we have no control. mr. milliband: i do think there is a wider issue by the opportunity for our young people. the and david were talking about apprenticeships. we bring a lot of people into this country contributing to our countries. apprenticeships in i.t. are falling in our country. if you want to bring in a skilled worker promotes or the
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european union, you must provide apprenticeships or the next generation. homegrown opportunity is an essential part of immigration. mr. clegg: the tricks of the trade while you are working on the floor. we have given it . we have -- new life. it has never been expanded on such a scale. it is a fantastic way to allow young people to get their first jobs. host: thank you very much all party leaders on that issue. you still have time to register to vote on may 7. you can do so online. our next question is from rebecca. >> i'm a 25 drilled graduate with a good job at my generation
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as a whole has it pretty tough. it cost more than our parents to go to university and high rent makes saving for our own home difficult if not impossible. we will be less well off than our parents and it feels we are paying for other people's mistakes. what will you do for my generation to help us to optimistic about our future? host: thank you very much. ms. wood: i believe we need to invest in our young people particularly in education. that is the best route out of poverty. you are right when you say young people today are going to fare worse than the older generation. it is the first time for long while the generation of today is going to be worse off than the generation he for it. -- before it. because of our position we
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cannot do for university. -- free university. we want to keep -- we like students to study so we can invest our public money into welsh universities. we would like some courses to be made available for free. i have talked about the need for doctors in the health service and we believe we can attract more doctors by providing free tuition for those particular skilled group of workers. mr. milliband: you speak for so many young people i meet who are asking why they are paying the price for hard times. that is what i'm going to turn around if i am your prime minister. we have to guarantee all dumb people access to a good education. you get a high-quality apprenticeship -- all young
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people access to a good education. i don't want our young people drowning in debt when they leave university. we have to create good jobs for young people. that is why we will ban the explication of a zero hours contract. lastly, we will build 200 homes a year by 2020 and get a fair deal for young people in the private sector. i believe in the promise of britain, the next generation doing better than the last. prime minister cameron: thank you for your question. i think it is crucial. the most important thing is to make sure there are good jobs for people to do. in the last parliament, we had created 2 million new jobs. i think apprenticeships and universities are vital. i want our young people to have the choice of either. we have uncapped university
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places so would ever place can go to university. in terms of building homes, i want to build homes people can afford to buy. not available to foreign buyers or investment funds but therefore british people to buy and own. it seems odd to answer a question from a young person about pensions. but it is important to dignity and security in old age. we security pension, because all people should look forward to dignity and security at the end of a hard-working life. ms. bennett: rebecca, we believe that education is a public good, therefore it should be paid for by progressive taxation, more progressive than we have now. look at the fact on this.
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students are leaving university with 44,000 pounds worth of debt. 33% of current figures will never pay that off. they go through 33 years of their life, from their 20's to mid 50's. anytime you earn any sort of money of all, you'll be putting a chunk of your income to some think you can never pay. we in the green party not only want zero tuition fees, we also want to pay off student loans company debts so people do not have that waste of debt. we also need changes in housing, which is why we are calling for a minimal wage of 10 pounds an hour by 2020. mr. clegg: i famously, infamously put into practice in my party's tuition fees.
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they were jacked up by labor and there is no money left. but we did the next best thing and think elite there are more people going to university than ever before. if i couldn't do that, i hope some fair-minded folk will acknowledge the other things i am very proud to do to get more opportunities, to create a stronger economy and a fairer society. we talked about more apprenticeships than ever before. the huge tax cuts, thing note -- paying a no tax on the first 600,000 pounds that you are. -- that you earn. healthy meals at lunchtime for little children at primary school. these are the things that make a very future for future conjunctions. josh future generations. ms. wood: we have also kept
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access to university free of tuition fres. -- tuition fees. i grew up in a working-class family. as the politician knows, i have a note right -- have no right to take that entitlement for the next generation. i will do whatever it takes to keep access to universities free. i think it is shameful for any politician who is benefited from that to take it away from others. mps in the house of commons anywhere i will always support the principle that your access to education as i don't person should be based entirely on your ability to learn, and never, ever on your ability to pay. [applause] host;mr. farage: i think there are a group of people in this
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country who are having a fantastic time. they are of the rich. they go to the 7% of schools who are wealthy enough to pay for education. they are dominating politics, arts sports, in a way that i've never seen before. their families are getting richer and richer, and the cap grows with every single year. by a polishing grammar schools by a education, what we did was put up a ladder on tens of thousands of young men and women every year who would have done better had they gone into a grammar school. we encourage lots of people to go to university who actually were not academic, to have come out in a debt, and you would have done better with trade and skills. what-earlier on housing, we have a new house built every seven minutes to cope with education. -- cope with immigration. prime minister cameron: let me make a point about schools.
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under this government, we have a million or more children in good or outstanding school. we opened up the education system and encourage education providers -- teachers and charities to set up schools. i was at one today, the warrington kings academy. i think these free schools are a good institution. ed miliband's parties is no more and is completing shutting down the schools that are already getting going. whether they are free schools-- that is what we need. mr. miliband: twice the conservative party planning to cut money from schools? mr. clegg: that is no way to guarantee fairness. prime minister cameron: 10 billion pounds for new primary school. we sat in the cabinet room together, we took
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difficult decisions together. i defend all of the decisions i took. mr. clegg: no, i repeatedly when your party wanted to cut spending and i said no. you don't make society ferrite cutting money that goes to nurseries, colleges, and schools. mr. miliband: i would say david cameron is wrong, we do not want a future where we have unqualified teachers. there is a bigger issue. rebekah asked the question about young people going into the world today. you saw david cameron and nick clegg defend a system which ensures that young people in universities which is 44,000 towns was that. he didn't have to leave school with 44,000 pounds worth of debt, nor did i. but the difference is that i will do something about it.
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and nick, you are describing as a broken promise as the next best thing. it was a broken promise you betrayed the young people of our country. mr. clegg: i get this pious from ed miliband, who said there is no boom and bust and crashed our economy. i apologized and took responsibility for the mistake i made. ed miliband, you apologize for crushing the economy-- saying i'm sorry for crushing the british economy. mr. miliband: the banks were under regulated. let me just put this out -- david, when you are as leader of the opposition, you are think the banks were overregulated.
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we will not take threatens new about the global financial process. [applause] blessed government did not spend enough, do not taxing of. young people suffered the most. i do not control debt, i do not control spending, young people suffer the most. host: ed miliband, thank you. natalie bennett. ms. bennett: i think we were talking about education, so perhaps we can go there. [laughter] particularly the point david cameron raised about free schools. we have a system with the economies of the former government that were based on competition, the ids that schools compete with each other and fight with each other. the green party does not believe that should be foundation of schooling. want to bring free school and economy back under local authority control and
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cooperative. we need a system that is not focused on exams, that a exempt factory that shows children into exam after exam. they need a education for life, a broader education that includes things like first aid cooking, sex and relationship education, personal finance education. we need a much broader education that prepares our young people. ms. wood: there will be more cuts to education. it will be difficult continuing the grant past 2017. if labor wins, they will cut the grant by 2.2% according to the iff, that is one billion pounds over the course of the next term. the toieries will more than double that. it will be difficult under those circumstances. that is why we must and austerity. if we--- we must end austerity.
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we too can afford free tuition fees for students in wales. ms. sturgeon: i think we have seen why we need to break the old boys network in west windsor. -- westminster. if you listen to ed miliband, or in 1997 tony blair promised nutrition freeze and then raised to them. -- no tuition fees and then raised them. if you want at milton, if he does get to be prime minister to keep his promise on tuition fees and other progressive policies that he is now promising, i would hope there are pms in the house of commons keeping him honest. host: there are a lot of issues into this question.
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was not just about education, it was about housing too. it was possibly about the younger generation paying for other people. mr. clegg: on the housing point, rebecca and others are worried about not getting your feet on the first rung of the property ladder. we have an idea, and is this -- lots of young people cannot afford a mortgage on a property. will be would do is introduce a rent to own scheme, or he will not need a deposit to buy a house, but every time you paid your rent at market rate, you build up a share of ownership in your home. by renting you become overtime and owner in your home. i think that would be a great way to introduce in the next parliament to give people like rebecca that tangible belief that they can hope to live in a home which they can call their own. mr. farage: i think this is
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about demand and supply -- markets are about demand and supply. if you how to build a house every seven minutes to cope with people coming into britain, you have a problem. an independent government can do without. but we need to build lots of houses. the problem is the developers want to build on greenfield sites. it is cheaper for them, it is better for them. and indeed, changes in the mining laws mean it is much easier for them to build on those sites. i think what government needs to do -- i don't always want government to intervene, but i do think your government should supply grounds and make decontamination of brownsville sites -- of brown field sites so the could be big for developers. we could build 200,000 houses on the sites and solve a big part of the problem. ms. wood: we are taking a range of steps in it shared equity not only to help young people, but
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those taking their first steps to own a house. it would also protect affordable housing as well, and invest in greater numbers of affordable homes. there are some people, even with the help of shared equity, who will not be able in the short or medium term to buy their own home. we have a duty and a navigation to make sure we are providing good, quality housing to them. that is really important. mr. miliband: i want to talk about some thing important to young people, which is renting in the private sector. it is often incredibly insecure, often substandard accommodation. we are the only party with a plank to get a fair deal in the private renter sector. to your 10 -- 3 year tenancy. at the moment, they charge tenant and landlord fees. that is a massive issue for tenants across the country. we have do stand up to some of these powerful interests and make the country work for young people.
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host: let's turn to the final element of rebecca's q uestion. if elected, will you do to help my generation feel optimistic about our future? prime minister cameron: we have had a difficult time recovering for the appellant possession -- appalling recession that we have had. britain has still got some great strength. we are creating jobs, we are part of imported networks in the world. we have clout in the world. we have nurses in west africa helping to deal with ebola. we have some of the most brave and professional armed services in the world. and tonight it is a good night to say thank you for all that they do. >> there are people on the street better in armed services. -- that are in armed services. prime minister cameron: she
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makes a good point that there are people that come out of our armed services who do have -- mr. clegg: she does make a good point that there are people who amount of the armed services who do have difficulty. host: let us return to the issue about providing optimism for younger generations. natalie bennett. ms. bennett: i think i made in my opening marks, reference to climate change. that, of course is one of the critical issues we have to do with provide an optimistic future. much broader than that, we have to stop trashing our planet. we think about in britain today, we are using the roses of three planets when we only have one. we need to invest in our economy to do with that. -- we're using the trash of th ree planets when we only have one. the fact is in the last 40 years of my lifetime, the world has lost 50% of its vertebrate wildlife.
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half of the wild animals are going. mr. farage: our leaders aren't optimistic. our leaders don't think this country is good enough even to make its own laws. what i want to see is a self-governing united kingdom. a country which has pride, and the young people living in a global economy. let's reengage with a bigger wider world. the best place to start will be the 2.2 billion people that live in the commonwealth and who are our real friends. let's have a government that looks out for the world. ms. wood: the best place to provide optimism is the best conditions where someone can have a job. -- ms. sturgeon: by supporting
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small businesses through business relief to take on extra people. and also changing the way that the business sector contracts out to the private sector to guarantee more jobs to be local jobs. hotmr. clegg: the only way we will increase optimism is if we wiped the slate clean. i do not want my own kids, i do not want any of my own children to pay the price for this generation's mistakes. if i can leave rebecca or anyone with a figure in mind -- 46 billion pounds, that is what we as a country all spend next year just paying off the interest on our debts. just imagine the hundreds of houses of homes we could build 446 billion pounds. 46 billion pounds is the same as 700 pounds for every man, woman, and children this country. when i curate leaders implying that we shouldn't get rid of our
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deficit, i say, if you don't do that it is like saying we will not pay off our credit card bill and get our kids to pay for us. >> none of us said that. mr. miliband: i will be very practical about this. what is important for young people is the quality of jobs. 700,000 in our country on zero-hour contracts. hundreds of people waiting on text messages to go into work tomorrow. david cameron says that he probably could not win on 80 our contract, and neither can i. but i'm going to do something about it. it goes to what kind of country we built. ms. sturgeon: they brought it against an amendment to end zero hour contracts. why should people believe what he's saying about zero hour
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contacracts? prime minister cameron: their about 70 labor employees that employee zero hour contracts. so they do not practice what they preach. [applause] some of business leaders from iconic business brains big and small, saying that their plan is getting the country on the right track. if we go off the bat with ed miliband's plan, we put the recovery at risk and jobs at risk. young people have the most important thing of all-- [indiscernible] mr. miliband: there is a big choice in the elections. he thinks there are big corporations that want to trickle down to everyone else. we have tried the experiment
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over the last five years, and it has failed. host: thank you very much indeed for your comment on that. a very comprehensive question from rebecca. ladies and gentlemen, we have come to the end of our people and debate. there is been a lot to discuss your in the last two hours. a lot for us all to reflect upon. before we conclude tonight, i would invite each of the leaders to make a final and brief statement on why they think you should vote for their party on may the seventh. i will turn first to nick. ms. wood: you can get the same cuts and priorities, or you can vote for some thing better and more progressive. i went into this election with a clear message -- none of us can afford more austerity. none of us can afford more 30 billion pounds of cuts. no one can afford the 100 billion pounds that the tories, labor, and liberals intended to
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spend on nuclear weapons. their priorities are wrong, but they will pay the price -- it will be ordinary people that pay the price. we offer an alternative, a clear alternative. a plan for investment. yes, it is fiscally responsible, but it will also allow us to invest in infrastructure to protect our public services, to lift people out of poverty. to people in scotland, i say about for me for a louder voice. ours will be a voice to help bring about change. mr. clegg: thank you for sitting through this 2-hour political marathon. i have only one thing to ask of you, and it is this -- when you vote, decide what is right for you and your family. make sure you do what is right for country, but above all, make sure that we do not large this way or that. -- lurch this way or that. make sure we do not borrow too
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much or cut on the other. in other words make sure that when you vote, "country stable and strong and fair. and the only way we can do that despite finishing the job finishing it fairly, balancing the books, doing it fairly, and putting money into our public services. that is the only way we can create a society that i imagine we all want -- a society where we have a stronger economy and the ferret society, where there is opportunity for everyone. mr. miliband: you have heard from seven liters night. but there is-- seven leaders tonight. we carry on with a government that is not on your side? if i'm try mr., i will make sure that hard work rewards everyone in their country, not those who just get six-figure bonuses. if i'm pregnant history, i will take on those prime energy companies ripping you off.
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and if i'm prime minister, we will balance the books and protect education. there is a big choice in this election. i believe it is letting working people succeed to let the succeed. -- too much but in succeed. -- to let britain succeed. let's bring the change that britain it needs. ms. wood: i hope the words tonight do not fill you with too much despair. despite what you heard, there is a alternative to the westminster consensus. austerity is not inevitable, it is a choice. we can have a future where everyone has access to decent public services, where everyone can have a decent standard of living. but not if we keep doing things we always have been. for a stronger, more prosperous, greener wales. for a wales that counts.
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give your vote to the party of wales. for wales to be strong, like scotland, we must be strong. the more strength you give us, the greater influence we will have. let this be the success we know we can be. thank you. ms. bennett: if you want to change, you have to vote for it. i say, vote for what you believe in. you don't have to go on voting for the lesser of two evils. that is how we ended up with a tired, failed politics that we have now. if you want a fair economy, a public nhs vote for change vote green.
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already in parliament, we are seeing airline lucas make a huge impact. -- caroline lucas. we need more mps like caroline. with strong green mps, we can deliver a new brand of politics. you can deliver a new peaceful revolution. where you are in england wales scotland or northern ireland if you are thinking about voting green, do it. your vote will count. mr. farage: you see, i want you at the beginning, i said they were all the same. [laughter] what he saw tonight with the politically correct oh they are so keen to be popular on the international stage. they do not understand the thoughts and aspirations of all of the people in this country. they are detached. most of them have never had a job in the. -- in their lives. would be presenting -- what we
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represent in ukip is patriotism. if you want things to be shaken up and changed promptly, you have to put more ukip mps in westminster. we can outshine all expectations on may the seventh. let's do it. prime minister cameron: i have been your prime minister for the last five years. in all of that's time, i had tried to have one task in mind, which is putting the economy in place and clean up the mess that is put to us. i want to finish the job that we all started. we have created 2 million jobs, let us great a job for everyone that want and need oness one. let us have britain back in the black.
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let us keep investing in a national health service, and make sure that it is a genuine seven day a week service for your family all day around. what my plan is is basically one word -- security. security for you, for your family, for your country. this is an amazing country, and we are on our way back. there is a fundamental choice in this election -- stick with a team that brought you that plan because it is working and is helping, or put it all at risk for the people that dave is the spending, debt, taxes and waste. i say stick to the planet that is working, let's not go back to square one. let us finish what we started. host: my things to all of you -- my thanks to all of you. it has been a fascinating debate. and a big thank you to our audience here for all of the questions and to you at home for watching and of course those who
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joined us online. stay here for analysis and news at 10:00. there will also be a debate might on agenda. thanks for watching and good night. [applause] [no audio] [applause] >> during this month, c-span is pleased to present the winning entries in this week's student cam document rate commission. -- document recondition.
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students were asked to create a documentary based on the theme "the three branches and you." to demonstrate how a policy, law, or action has affected them or their community. justice best is one of our 11th grade winners. hers focused on animal conservation. >> it affects us all. we will all be affected by this. in a beautiful state like nevada, the hope of our state is the help ofalth of us. it impacts us all. the actual health of our wildlife relation -- wildlife publishes. >> does putting the sage-grouse
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on the list going to help? that is what we set out to discover. >> the greater sage-grouse is another declining species. over a century ago, there is over 16 million of these birds. today there is less than 200,000, and the number continues to drop. >> the current situation with the sage-grouse the numbers for the bird are about down to 5000. the amount of habitats that the bird has has been reduced by half since the early 1900s due to development branching wildfires, invasive species. they thrive in a sage brush habitat, and they only have half of what they previously had. last

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