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tv   Washington Journal Dr. Michael Osterholm  CSPAN  January 20, 2022 7:05pm-8:02pm EST

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leader mitch mcconnell and 2:00 p.m. eastern, a look at that presidential library the museum of, and the grand son of herbert hoover talks about how the library will evolve in the coming years and watch american history tv, saturday on "c-span2" and find a full schedule your program guide or watch online anytime as cspan.org. >> she's been .org is cspan's online store, now to her latest collection c-span product apparel, books, on the court, and accessories, there's something very heavy cspan fan repurchase that will support nonprofit operations on top now, or anytime@cspan shop .org. >> we will return now to the covid-19 pandemic and 20 this morning from minneapolis by dr.
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michael osterholm director of center for infectious disease research policy at the university of minnesota and dr. michael osterholm, to begin the conversation, can you take a picture of how you see the next four - six weeks the covid-19 pandemic in this country playing out. >> let me know right now, we have a national blizzard this occurring virtually in every state, and some of them are delayed by a week or two verses others were dispersing for example in the northeast but in general we are going to see very high number of cases in the setting for the next three - four weeks and will start to see the numbers drop and unfortunately we may have leveled off with case numbers in the northeast, which is a good thing, to remind people that it is kind of like when you're flying an airplane in the announced there will be getting our descent into such and such airport 30 minutes before you
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plan and is still left talk for a long time before you actually land even though you're coming down it was going to happen with these cases sorry is like the northeast are still going to be in a really bad way for at least the next three - four weeks and then i think after that, it is unclear how that bottom will occur in some of the number of cases is with what is happening in south africa right now, they are still running about 25 times the number of cases before omicron hits of all the big pieces come down to the baseline so entire pathetic card occurred in the united states, think that's a real possibility. >> so what should we be doing now to prepare for that scenario is there much more that we can do to prepare as is going on. >> right now we have to get through the next three - four weeks and you know at this point, our healthcare system in this country is hanging on by the skin of his teeth and we have a major shortage of adequate number of healthcare workers who are trying to be able to have the scary part of
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that is the fact that we have just sort of challenge in healthcare over the past few years and we have lost a number of people who have just quit after day in and day out of the battlefield light conditions and just cannot do it and on top of that we are seeing absentee rates of 20 - 30 percent and other areas in the country in healthcare and the fact that they do have income infected and credited the vaccinated and fully vaccinated with a boostern and are getting seriously ill, and they are going up and healthcare workers nonetheless infected and therefore off the job for a period of time but we can take and translate that to any number of things in our society and its way right here in the twin cities, the metropolitan area as well as around the country, and a number of pharmacies that have been closed because they did not have enough workers and we can i get the garbage picked up and we are having problems getting in drugs delivered to the hospitals and i can get in the laundry list of issues and so i just keep coming back to the fact that it is like the schools, nobody wants to close the schools right now and nobody wants kids do not be in
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school, they should be good when you have up to 35 percent are teachers out sick, how can you run a school alone safely and so ife think that just getting peoe just like real snow blizzard, this viral blizzard will be over in three - four weeks in most parts of the country we just have to get through during that time. >> i got a lot of attention last week and washington postst and headlines from time to acknowledge reality in thee schools will likely have to close because of omicron and dr. michael osterholm is the author of the column from the washington post and then from the journal of american medical association, this piece is getting a lot of attention, national strategy for the new normal of life with covid-19 and again dr. michael osterholm one who joined in writing that, what is inor and do normal of covid-9 look like. >> we know we will continue to see this virus in our communities for ever, is not
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going to go away not going to be eradicated it the question is under what will they look like in a year ago, i began to realize just how important these periods were, they in fact could either be much more transmissible in anything that we could or evade the vaccines that we've had as well as the immunity against him havingg previously been infected and you know i have sent for some time, and a joke that every morning i wake up and i hear that old fifth dimension ten, this is the dawning age of aquarius, just keeping hearing this is the dawning age of the bavarian and then when delta and omicron came along it was also price of this is something we should expect but we have to expect that coulh happen in the future and a new variant and much more infectious and could escape the immune protection it says one side of the side that we have to do with an on the other hand we also have the situation or maybe this is in fact the last of the bed various to come out and how do
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we incorporate that into life and so we have to really plan for both eventualities and we can do that and we can have a new normal in a sense by getting back to that in one of the things that will be important i thank you so we will see that the vaccine can even be more powerful than think you will see the vaccines two-point oh three-point oh and four-point o3 in the days in the years ahead and i think that the drug therapies can be very critical and remember that if he were doing the show back in the early 1980s, having in the diagnosis of hiv was a death sentence and literally a death sentence and today, it's a manageable chronic disease for many many people and why because of the drugs and so one of the things we are really needing right now is a comprehensive international program for getting these drugsp to people as quickly as possible. i think for a lot of the stuff we have to really learn how to live with this fires in a way that does not make it because these big surges and subsequent
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resting on her healthcare system.in many instances today watching healthcare systems break and that's what the challenge will be for the future back to much of the stabenow is on just living with the virus but the public health restrictions that are being imposed because this virus and you talked about the journal article that you wrote about bench marks for when it imposes it would pull back those restrictions and how we keep suggest husband marks, is it with case counts, hospitalization, deaths, clinton should those sort of flex in and out. >> yes, that is a great question i think that is the very heart really plan for going forward it is normal and to date, we don't really have aor definition of wt is success with covid-19, and the idea was that we just a thing many believe that last spring and early summer with her
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all of the vaccines and the fact that we have a, the case numbers started to drop in late january early february and then people thought that it was done going to go away in a number of talking hands on the tv screens that were telling you that. no realize that is not the case, that is not going to go away, but his mature we use to determine if what we are successful is by default, or feel fear systems breaking that are we compromising care which we surely help in terms of heart attacks both in the automobile accidents and even those who have chronic conditions for acute conditions like cancer have had to postpone important surgeries and follow-up diagnostic testing and all because of covid-19 offense of what we propose an hour paper was effectively to understand that we have to adapt to the system with and support the system that when in fact,
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accommodate these surges and on top of that, what happens when you have an overlap of events where 50 - 70000 people can die in a bad winter season and covid-19 at the same time that's it what we looked at is what is the capacity we need to have to respond and plan accordingly and i the people that i don't realize that we do that in other areas our lives and right now one of the best things that fire department the state of minneapolis, airport fire department and i think that is a great investment and ironically, we have not had a major plane crash reservation at the airport since its inception with two major crushers that occur to go above occurred in the 1950s in place and went down south minneapolis needle by the minneapolis our department do you think that we would go one day without that very very well trained and supported fire department, no i think it were going to have to look at her healthcare system in the same way and w amateur we have to be able to compensate for these
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huge surges in the cases so we can handle it and that will be personnel and beds and equipment and we've just never address that, literally we have let this pandemic go in a way that whatever does not cause the system to break. >> coming back to the school closure is there a benchmark that you see for school closures in the argument but just maybe reality with omicron taking worker seven schools but going forward it, we should be the benchmark for opening and closing school. >> will you know paraphrase the famous supreme court justice, is like pornography can't define it read but i know it when i see it, the school district know that if in fact they can hold the classes today, in a manner in which could say for the students to come from the vantage point of supervision, that is over talking about, running in trying to sustain it
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even an intermediate level of learning it but it suddenly 30 - 35 percent of your faculty and your teachers, you support staff coming bus drivers are out, fact have basic school system pretty and i do not think that anyone would disagree with it, but a hurricane hurricane buried on your community or you have major blizzard coming in with closed temporarily everybody is satisfied and i think that with this recent omicron search, god melded into the discussion and the actions of previous school closings over the past two years which lasted months and months and months that i think that none of us want to go back to that. but at the same time, how can you deny the critical nature of supervision in school when you don't have anybody there and, i mean, we have had school districts in this country and eventually put please up to the parents to come in because they were so committed to keeping the schools open at that date virtually just wanted adult supervision to babysit the kids and then saw school, that's odd
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education so we have to understandably is challenging how important it is to have schools open, nobody is suggesting that this be like yesterday of approach to the schools but for the sake of the next three - five weeks, but not how anyone could not appreciate that you cannot safely hold school and you don't have adult supervision there was a surge is over, you have every reason to go back to school district it will know that and they will say, we have enough people today, we have enough teachers and substitute teachers and support staff about five or ten weekend did that and that's what i think the local schools in their control can say, we are back to do it i think with the punches that are doing everything they can to educate your students and safely as possible. >> dr. michael osterholm joining us from minneapolis the director of university minnesota research and policy for diseases in herel to take your phone calls one as
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usual recently, 202748 - under 8000 and (202)748-8001 and lined up calls, and market is in winchester, virginia and a first good morning. >> hello and thank you for taking my call and i just wanted to ask the doctor, i guess you know and always saying that this thing is actually more contagious but less deadly. i just would like to get the thoughts on that and generally, that's how it is for viruses, maybe were just mutation away from this is being the common cold. or some other sickness and i guess that would be first and. >> let's take out because there are a lot of calls for letting up the topic. >> well, that is the right question in a very important question and when we tried to
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describe his diseases mild, it really is a misnomer, so really adequately describing what is happening, what it means is let's just take the previous variant we have dealt with delta, and we just say that if you have a thousand cases of delta, you might have 100 that were severely ill requiring hospitalization in many cases, sump risk of death well along comes omicron, give a thousand cases again, this time only ten are likely to become serious illness and die. you say that's a real advantage with the problem is that the omicron virus is infected more than tenfold more than you saw with delta and the absolute number of people going to the healthcare system severe disease actually is higher than what we saw before even with the other variants and that is what were seeing an unprecedented number hospitalization and death climbed dramatically in a number of areas of the country is that when we talk about it on an individual level of a more mild
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or not mild case, generally speaking it is on the other hand, as the population this is a huge challenge this is actually creating more seriouses illnesses and create more deaths than we've actually seen during the previous areas that have come along and in terms of mutation issue that you raised me just press that quickly and say that you are right, we do not know what the future brings this viruses during two urgent miles an hour balls from the very beginning we do not know if next. might not be at milder variants and good news situation but justice easily could be the office and i think we've had to learn our lesson time and time again and we can for more mild variant to be in the future but the hope is not a strategy and we have to understand it that it has more severe. we have to beha prepared for tht another voice will get caught flat-footed again as a world punches the country but as the world and that's what we do not want to do alexandria,
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louisiana, good morning you're on with dr. michael osterholm. >> good morning cspan and god bless you and god bless you as well dr. michaelel osterholm. i was a military police officer trade in the school and fort mcclellan alabama and we trained in biowarfare and my conclusion my dad was a korean war vet and he died of covid-19, but he had a kidney cancer and prostrate cancer so between the radiation and chemo, is t immune system ws just destroyed. i was exposed to him with covid-19 and i never did get sick and i never did get they'll anything like that so when i want to know from you, do you believe that this is a biological weapon and that was released him by the communist chinese to destroy trump in america and thank you. >> let me just be really clear about this, this virus originated from animals, no question about that in the big
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question is not whether it was engineered virus made to attack the human population, there is no evidence to support that involve the question flaws in the laboratory in china and when researchers were working on it and it accidentally escaped from there, not an intentional release just accidental i think it at this point all the data doesn't think that this was a natural spillover from animals but that we can this point rule out that it could not have been an accidental release of the laboratory and wuhan so we still have to go with the possibility of either one of those although as i said them i think that the information we have been a source animals but let me give you a very clear and compelling piece of evidence that supports why animals not only were the source, but that can continue to be a very important source of variant and i have spent the better part of my life working
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in wildlife this spilled over into humans i was shocked, aloof really shocked that is not happen often in my career after he and the business for 46 years to see the original data became from white tailed deer in the united states and this was a study connected in iowa is the time, replicated in a number of other states and if you look over the last year, the frequency of and whitetail deer parallels exactly what was w happening in humans and meaning that if they were looking at the roadkill dear frequently, then actually going just testing the blood to see they may have been infected with actually isolating the virus from the deer then doing the genetic sequencing to identify it with a finger print back approach to say this is the same we see is in humans and what we saw was over the course of that year, is the case numbers went up in iowa and number and the deer went up a
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lot and how did that happen, what was going on and headed the deer get infected from humans and what is the risk of the deer somehow transmitting that back to the humans when we have contacted with the hunting seasons and etc. could there be a new. that would emerge it from there whitetail deer population and i can take you right now there are many other animal species, cats, felines that have also become infected with this virus, sars-cov-2 in some cases quite readily so that i think that we are really in this very very difficult place dance right now between the wildlife, the virus in humans and i do not know where it will come from it could come from transmission in humanf where on human it christmas it to another in the process, mutations that occur get a new. that way for could it be into animals than six - 12 - 18 months later, go back into the humans again and this time somewhat different variant so i think this one of the reasons
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why i said the people, i sleep with one eye open looking for the variant i think this is still a big question that we do not know, what would've been the future is a sad moment ago i can only hope that we do not see more serious. the good challenger health and healthcare systems but i can't say that won't happen and this is going to be a key issue following what is happening in the animals and we call this the one health approach where animals and humans are intricately links right now with sars-cov-2 we just have to understand that sue met to mention your 2017 book, laceyen enemy, war against killer germs and when you wrote that book is, how concerned are you about highly transmissible mystery virus like covid-19. >> will actually chapter 13 in the book is called sars-cov-2 numbers and the things to come in so meeting the two previous
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coronavirus is they were concerned about so i think that we saw that front and center of the political issue but then we had two chapters on what a pandemic would look like and in this case, influence of a wee talked about the issue that you have very rapidly spreading it fire is highly transmissible what could he do and if you read a book, he read what is happening today coming to just take out the word influenza put in the work covid-19, and that's exactly what we are sing happen. >> good morning jeff you werell next. >> hi good morning and thank yon dr. michael osterholm and i want to pick up on the point that you're making and this is basically to predicate a case for robustly financing public health to basically mitigate the next pandemic it which will certainly come, is there an increasing frequency over the
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past few decades and principally think that you described moments ago, there's always that the climate change and particularly the yes. >> finisher question. >> yes so to my point, i sent a proposal to the presidents into the congress for the federal reserve system to finance an organization that is the same sort of governance and accountability would finance public health in perpetuity will provide trust for each community and every community but have a link workforce as part of the effort and all the capacities in the national community levels and could i send that proposal to you dr. michael osterholm and i would be delighted to do that in thank you. >> short and i think that the
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point you're raising it, very critical point and we actually cover that in the articles in the journal of american medical association was reference earlier that in fact we really need to understand that i like to think of the old commercial back when i was a kid for the old oil filters, you pay me now or you will pay me later and we are now and fourthly, the beneficiaries of that pay me now or pay me later situation. and that in fact, we are recognizing it inadequacy of our public health system when people want accurate numbers right now, what is happening, when they want to know for clarity what is going on in our community, to realize how many say local health departments are still getting case reports in on the fax machines, i mean, we literally are back you know, ten - 15 or 20 years ago in communication and not it braided or infrastructure we not it braided what it takes to provide
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highly precise and important information that we need to understand it in order to approach these pandemics and so i think that this is really important and the other thing that i would just say is were now watching firsthand what a pandemic can do to the global economy and so if you want to understand why it's important to have the pandemic enforces about human life, human suffering and is also about their economies in the world and what we can prepare and provide an have to say that i have a piece coming out in foreign affairs that actually addresses the issue of also of what is happening in china now in china has adopted this year of covid-19 policy, which it down anything to stop the transmission been trying to stop omicron is like trying toyi stop the wind, you might diverted that you won't stop it and i think that the chinese government is in a collision course with destiny right now they cannot maintain zero
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covid-19 keep shutting down parts parts of their country without really fatal injury to their economy and for the rest of the world which you know as wehi know, china is a major supy chain source for so many things. so i think again, public health is really critical if you want to have a good economy one half a robust economy and of god have a good public health system they can do with this and right now i think that has largely missed the many of the discussions. .. he wrote that it is essential to build trust and a belief in collective action. they have experienced lower rates of hospitalization from covid-19. how do you go about rebuilding that trust in the u.s.?
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guest: it starts with one word, communication. i was born and raised on a small iowa farm town. i think we have all been hearing about the all we have been hearing about is the confusion and mixed messages and unclear message that have been coming out about this pandemic. now we have to be clear, this is an evolving site situation. we are learning more, more, more all the time. i say it somewhat jokingly but some seriousness there are days i feel i know less about this virus now than i did six months ago. so we have to communicate very clearly. we have to communicate what we know very clearly. we have to communicate what we are going to do to find out about that uncertainty and how we are going to address it. have not done that.
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we have not done it so the average american feels like i know what is going on. so to me that has become a very important part of the trust in our communities. people will stay with you. they won't be with you if you tell them as honestly as you can, as clear as you can what it is we know. the cdc changed its recommendations feel be isolated if you are infected or quarantined if you've been exposed but you do not go forward with with that i support it one 100%. why? we have a number in this country of patients we are short of healthcare workersrs that has a mild system wearing
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an and 95 respirator, they are helping the patient a specialist and othero covid patients. i do not need to have them be isolate it for ten days to now this is a crisis situation. i think the same is true it's seen as we somehow skirting around the sciences. or trying to deal with crisis in her hand. as a former i'm willing to take people who are willing to work who still may be infected i think it iss really important that we explained to people what we are doing in a way they can understand. we are good at communication, we good to acknowledge what we know and n don't know, they as a
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public will largely stay with you. >> the white house is in a lot of communication about the issue of testing and access to testing. happen on abc this week. criticisms about the white house and having enough access to testing. this is about ahi two minute clip you want to play to get your thoughts on it. >> we are seeing hospitals are overwhelmed, icus are jammed. it's been nearly two months in the open cron variant is a variant of concern. and yet the cdc just upgraded its masked recommendation withho website to order the rapid test will not go live until wednesday but a group of democratic senators is wondering why this took so long? writing the administration
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either knew or should have known the testing shortages were occurring across the country over i the past several months but the full expectation the virus would likely mutate into a new variant. increase testing access should have happened before the currentne wave hit not several weeks into the surge. how would you respond to that doctor murphy? >> martha, we are certainly in there tougher part of the omicron wave right now. as you mentioned case numbers are high in hospitals are struggling but that's one of the reasons we've surged so many people from the federal government to support hospital systems.s. we sent millions of pieces of equipment to them with regard to testing said very clearly in december we made a lot of progress on testing but we have more to do. the investments made the billions of dollars, the approval of nine more tests helped us to dramatically increase our testing in 2021 of quadrupling in fact.
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when open cron came an extraordinary increase in demand. the u.s., the uk and others found themselves without as much testing as they needed part were pulling out the stops on testing which is right in the 50 million tests to committee health center the 20000 locations where people can get free chess. >> i know what you are doingd now, but the question is, why wasn't it done sooner? look, you say you hold out hope that you plan for the worse. does not sound like that nohappened. >> there was a planning, martha in this execution on increasing these tests. if you compare december to january of 2021, there was a dramatic increase more than eight fold increase in testing in fact during that timeframe.
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the challenge was omicron created an extraordinary increase in demand, even beyond the incredible increase that was secured during 2021. and so we have to close that gap. that is exactly what we have been doing it so i plan to keep doing. >> after abc news, doctor on access to testing and whether there should be more at this point. >> oh. well, i think doctor tried to lay out the reality of the testing situation. the oma cron surge has created a need for testing unlike anything since the beginning of the pandemic. this is not just true for the united states is true for the world. the countries like the united kingdom were touted as having the best testing program in the world with ready access to at home testing the pcr testing et cetera has also been challenged by the sudden surge in cases. but i think the challenge we have right now is that we have
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to anticipate these searches can happen. it's not just our federal government that was not prepared for a surge of this nature. many of my colleagues have been on the tv talk shows and the media that the worst is over. a lot of people have fought this i think it's just a realityha check, no it is not. we may have to be prepared for this again. i think the second piece that goes back to answer get to the previous question is communicate as honestly as you can with the public. rather they continue to tout the 500 tests that are coming out which by the way is only over one half test per person for the whole country, just say we are going to be short. we know we are. we have to figure out how we are going to use these tests the best. we are wasting so much testing today. for example we do a single test to bring people back to a certain location whether it be
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schools, workplace, whatever. then we feel we somehow accomplish that for that's kind of like buying a brand-new house and have a smoke alarm that works in the first day then it's done a pretty to test day in and day out for going to stop a transmission or school or whatever. we do not have enough test to do that. we have to tell people that who should be getting tested? people are clinically ill to make sure they have covid or not. we need to test those from the standpoint of who they might expose that could become seriously ill like healthcare workers who might expose other patientsts in hospitals like cancer patients. we have not yet prioritize the testing. number one were not going to have nearly enough for the bforeseeable future. that is the reality. let's get on with it. what are you doing to fill in that gap? we have more tests coming it's not going to be here in the next three or four weeks to make that big difference. number two prioritize what testing we do have.
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number three level with the public what it means i want to paint the example it points out the one time testing. i am aware of five different circait stances they have college age students coming home from the fall semester for christmas. they were all tested back at the universities and colleges two -- four days before they came home. all were negative when they come home. and yet by the time they got home they'd gotten infected and all five of them became ill in the first one -- two days home and transfer the virus to everybody in the house. the bottom lined was the test they had four days before or five days before did not mean the moment after their tests are of the swab taken they did not get exposed. we have not explained that to the public very well at all
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for the fact of the matter is the test is a one time measure that whatever happens two hours later could put you at risk. that is why you have to be mindful of how you are being exposed. are you in the public? what respiratory are you wearing? are you vaccinated? we put far too much weight on testing to say we are protected and we are not. so one, weei need more tests. too we've got to be honest but we have and how to use them and three, note that this surge is going to be largely over in the next four -- five weeks. what i worry then is everyone will say we do not need tests anymore. we will notee be ahead. >> of the university of minnesota there from minneapolis plenty of calls for your sir as we always do it 10:00 a.m. eastern for this is kathleen and north
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carolina, good morning. >> good morning, thank you so much for taking my call. this is the first time i've ever called so i'm kind of nervous. i've been wanting to ask this question for about a year end a half now. i am 64 years old and very healthy. i eat right, i sleep at least eight hours every night pretty exercise every day. back in july 2020 i tested positive for covid. my only symptom was that i lost my sense of smell. i never felt bad, i continued exercising every day, i was yjust fine. now we fast forward to last week i was told by four different people they had covid and i was exposed to them. i am still fine. i have not been vaccinated. but i have a healthy lifestyle. i feel like it's been a real missed opportunity for experts to talk about the importance
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of a natural immunity within us who live right, eat right, get enough exercise anda rest. >> well, congratulations on your lifestyle. it's a great thing to have. and to be able to obviously reducere your risk of so many other diseases that could come up with lifestyle choices. let me be really clear the immunity you got from a previous infection wears off over time. we have seen it many, who have gottenon reinfected with a second episodes. in some cases much more severe than the first one. so at this point i would urge you please get vaccinated. you may have been lucky to this point of not getting reinfected. your lifestyle will not change that. this virus does not care if you are healthy or not when it affects you.po what it will mean is if you are healthier you have a better chance of not having a
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serious illness than if you are not too. but out urge you right now and anyone out there who is not vaccinated even if you've had previous covid, you need to get vaccinated. >> in potomac, maryland goodal morning. good morning. >> good morning. >> my question to you is this, i have recovered from covid and i had to get another pcr and i am still sloughing off dead viral cells. is that wasting an antigen test to use that also? because i am sure it's going to come back that i am still positive but they are dead viral cells. by the way you need to replace doctor fauci you are the voice of truth and honesty, knowledge, you are impeccable and we are missing out on you and that leadership role.
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we do thank you very much for your kind comments i wish you could read by e-mail you might not think that was the case if you were to see all that but thank you. we are all trying to the best we can. in terms of the testing you nailed it. the challenge we have is once you have been infected either by pcr or the antigen test you may stay positive forea some time long after no longer infected if he became ill and tested i would not be worried about getting another test at all. if you are at less than that on you want to go out and about than i would say get tested. but knowing and then it still likely to be positive and doesn't tell you i am really infected and infectious or it might no longer basically putting out viruses that could
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affect others as you have said. how many days out have you been out with their illness? what's i think we lost the collar. >> she raises a great point and reemphasize when she at five -- ten days out at thised point getting tested does not provide you any new additional information. >> the collar so you should replace anthony faucher brita viewer on twitter is the twitter handle saying doctor michael combines common sense with science and that is a good thing. i'm wondering after pretty contentious confrontation between doctor anthony fauci i wonder what advice you might give in public health officials in general. >> first byhe the utmost he has
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carried the heavy burden i very strongly support him and i find the political system right now ishe so broken in terms of trying to get out sciencey information. i called back to an earlier answer i provided to a question was a simple communication for its being able to explain things like a said about my hometown in iowa. if i cannot explain it to the 10:00 o'clock coffee club at the local restaurant, what am i doing? to me it's not big fancy words or signs for the second thing is telling the truth. that truth often means humility, i don't know but this is why i don't know. this is what i am going to learn if i do this or do that to understand it. then i will share that with you. i think sometimes we get into
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theie public roles we have a sense we cannot acknowledge we don't know. we do not have a sense of humility. with this virus you have too. when you're trying to catch a 210-mile hour curveball you've got to have thed ability. i think that is what we right now need to do to best communicate with the public and help gain their trust that we are doing everything we can. some things we can do better. some things are absolutely at the mercy of mother nature herself it's like a regular blizzard. you cannot control 38 incheshe of snow in 48-mile an hour wind can happen. you can control what is my plan to open the road? how am i going to do it how my get a mixed electricity electricity stays on? were trying to understand but we can't control but we have to be able to respond too. what is at about a response and how we are well we are doing? to me kept it simple, communicate honestly and with humility. >> miami,th florida this is
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michael you are next. >> caller: hello dr. kagan when you c speak about clear and concise communication always take my breath away that's how you build trust. i am hoping your ability to answer simple yes to these things required knowledge of dictionary, simple knowledge you do not need a phd. it has not been done and i'm hoping you can do it i'm sure you can. public policy of natural herd immunity our governor here in florida promotes keeping universities open specifically increase herd immunity. spreading disease of a policy of social darwinism. that is important at least torn the second thing which he said social darwinism by definition is also eugenic. the 1860s was eugenic of bias. this applies to think tax on
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both sides based on a false science based solely on competitions. and in truth it's cooperation bring. >> help me with your question michael what is your question? >> yes, sir. >> what is your question? >> the question is can he simply answer that is a fact in pursuing a policy kids with smallpox blankets can spread disease for any politician to say that is horrible. let me in that the doctor jump in. >> first of all i have been one of those saying herd immunity does not exist with this virus. once you have enough people of immunity through vaccination or through natural infection the virus were no longer spread.
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one of things we are recognizing as i may be immune today but over time is waning immunity i may get reinfected tomorrow. so at that point herd immunity goes out the windowsp right there because at best it's a temporary state of being immune. this is why we need to look carefully at multiple doses of the vaccine.ma and as you know piercing a number people right now who have been fully vaccinated who are becoming cases of omicron. the good news is they are still at it much, much lower risk of having serious illness, hospitalization and death. the immunity did not protect them from getting infected which is what herd immunity is all about part a protected them against serious illness. the idea you can let this burn through a community and then were done, one and out is not the case at all. that is something we need to get out there to people because in fact begs a
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question then what would you long-term? we need the drugs omicron is demonstrated people to get reinfected by. >> less than ten minutes left this is luis and fredericksburg virginia good morning prayer. >> good morning. first off i will state i amve not a fan, i think he is one of the big problems with communication in 2020 when he insists he never approached any therapeutics. and i know president trump desperately wanted to get therapeutics out as quick as possible. the said oh no let's get the vaccine first. so no, i am not a fan. so on. >> guest: i like to dress up straight on parade this is the
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part about being honest and being fair. that is simply not the truth. i have actually been a very strong supporter of new therapeutics. as you heard me early in the show commented on about hiv and how the very model of taking hiv from a life-threatening disease to one of a chronic illness status was all about therapeutics. the caller is misinformed. i'm a very strong supporter of therapeutics and therapeutic research literally from day one. march of 2020 was on the joe rogan podcast and i said and the next 18 months the pandemic would continue to rage at over 800,000 people would die. and we needed to do everything we go with vaccines and drugs to address it. eighteen months later, 800,000 people in this country have been dead. we are still short on getting therapeutic agents to the
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place this is part of the challenge we have on this role that some of us have played. we get faxes stated that others say about us. i have read quotes before and said who said this only tole have it and. ma'am, you are wrong on the conclusion. you arere right on the issue need therapeutics badly and i very much support that. >> how long do you think until they are readily available and highly effective? >> barely have highly effective ones. i think the practice of drug in particular has a lot of potential per their others are on the pike the most recently approved a merck drug is less likely to be ass effective for the challenge we have right now isd number one again the supply chain and production and getting it around the world. second of all we need to up our game dramatically for testing. one of the things we want to do is test people early in
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their infection do they in fact have covid? that means rapid turnaround of the test results. you can not wait three, four, five days. we need to have a distribution sentence. imagine the following i become symptomatic i get testy within 24 hours. i got my results back within hours.nn i get the drug dispensed to me within hours after that. that is a highly effective system which will guarantee we will dramatically reduce serious illnesses, hospitalizations and deaths. that is a reality. this is not being me up scotty, this is real we just have to do it. this is what we talked about with the new normal. one of things were going have to do is put in place a system of availability of testing, availability of drugs in a way to match up people in the earliest symptoms with these drugs. that could happen within the next year globally.
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and he has no wedding in florida all morning. go ahead andy. quick stress on the right? >> go ahead andy. the whole point i wanted to talk about us people to go out to him vaccinated. there is still a huge protection against this virus. hope you have not been vaccinated, go ahead and get started now. god bless you if you already did it and if you got boosted. and second of all, the n95 masks the only admission i would make is make sure you buy one that has the seal. i will not name names it's a large company that makes paper products. you might recognize it if you walk into a home store. ask them where the masks are
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outbreak a little rule there. they just have got to wear masks. >> we need to sign andy up as a spokesperson, very well set i could not agree more thank you. that is the kind of messaging that is so important. it's right on the market. >> to do away with cloth masks how are you on that? >> i said that in april of 2020. cloth masks were nothing more than decorative, that is it very limited protection. in addition if your going to wear: a mask just as andy said, where it correctly. right now we have been doing a study wherean we follow from time to time screenshots of people in tv news the public to see how they are wearing their masks. whether they are or not. nonetheless the consistent 25%
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of people wear under their nose. like three to five anglers in your summer and that's any protection at all. that will a lot to do our risk make sure you do not have a serious illness is also get vaccinated. >> this is deborah good morning. >> yes hello. just to continue on with the idea of how important vaccinations are, especially for the high risk groups. i am immune compromised and over 65. however, i had the j and j vaccine, which i boosted with a moderna booster. i still do not feel comfortable or safe. could you tell me something to ease my mind? >> guest: first of all let me
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just ease your mind by saying you've done what you can, you have done it right. that is good. there will be a point where you will be able to get the additional booster beyond what you had with a j in the j and the one additional shop. that's not yet recommended i think it will be over time. but just with what you have, you have surely given yourself a real margin of safety if you do get infected of actually having a much less severe illness.ti so congratulations on that and when a booster might become available for that third shot, go get that. right now you've done everything right but you can and i commend you for that. so if you're interested reading more from doctor good twitter to handle as his twitter handle that's where he posts many of his articles that he writes. and his comments on medical issues as they develop. doctor of the university of
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minnesota research and policy, thanks of your time this morning.tw >> thank you. i just want to put a plug-in for c-span these kinds of opportunities here. you've serve such a unique role in these communities having a veryne extended thoughtful conversations. my hatat is off to is part of a solution to getting information out about covid so thank you. >> inc.'s are kind of you to say. ♪ ♪ >> see spanish unfiltered view of government. funded by these television companies and more including cox. >> cox is committed to providing eligible families access to affordable internet. connect to compete program bridging the digital divide one connected at a time. cox, bringing us closer. >> cox support c-span as a public service along with these other television providers. giving a front row seat to democracy.
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>> weekends on cspan2 are an intellectual feast. every saturday you will find events people explore our nation on american history tv on sunday but tv brings delays in nonfiction books and authors as television for serious readers. learn, discover, explore, weekends on cspan2. ♪ ♪ the house select committee on the modernization of congress held a hearing on recommendations to make congress more effective, efficient and transparent. we will hear about telework, staffing and committee voting systems. >> congress can be a tough place to get things done i think we are proving it is possible. to date the committees pass a total hundred 42 to make congress more efficient and effee

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