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tv   Reliable Sources  CNN  January 25, 2015 8:00am-9:01am PST

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euro. if you come to the beautiful country of switzerland, of course just be prepared for a tourist the price of chocolate at the moment is outrageous. thanks to all of you for being part of my program this week. from davos, i will see you next week. xxx xxx good morning. a lot ahead. brand-new box office totals for "american sniper." hollywood has never seen anything like this. it is astonishing. is patriotism pushing aside inconvenient facts. also a little later, she is back or is she? sarah palin says quote, she's seriously interested in a white house run in 2016. aren't we all being fooled here? how seriously shoot media take her. an impassioned plea from the parents of two of the victims from the aurora, colorado movie shooting. they say sources should not show
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the shooter's picture. the sports world whodunit the super scandal before the super bowl. who or what let the air out of tom brady's football. tom brady, new england patriots said it wasn't him. head coach bill belichick is denying any wrongdoing. in an odd, odd press conference, belichick turned scientist, even while denying a scientist, explaining in detail how weather contributed to 11 footballs became underinflated in the hugely important game. >> the atmospheric conditions were adjusted to the climatic conditions. the balls, you know, reached an equilibrium. they were down approximately 1.5 per square inch. this is the end of this subject for me for a long time. okay? >> so we heard there how he failed to mention how the indianapolis colts footballs were somehow immune to those same conditions he was just
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describing. officials say patriots footballs were in fact underinflated but they are not sure how it happened or who, if anyone is responsible for it. you can almost hear investigative reporters kicking into high gear. somehow deflategate became one of the top news stories in the country. why? keep in mind nfl is basically a big media company. they produce entertaining competitions for tens of millions of viewers. to scandals on the field, even perceived scandals can sometimes really affect the networks hotelwho televise the games. let me bring in two players. guys welcome. >> thank you. >> thanks for having me. >> chris, you were a punter. what do you think happened here? >> i think the patriots definitely deflated the balls to try to gain a competitive advantage. i think overall it doesn't really matter. from the initial reports that are out, the refs reinflated
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them at halftime they are doing it with regulation footballs. nfl rules mean something for people to be concerned about rather than what the psi is in a football. >> you wrote fortime "time" magazine you said when you played you would do whatever you could to make the footballs easier to kick. give me examples of that. >> so basically, slightly different than quarterback balls. the team gets the balls ahead of time. equipment managers get a week to break them in. because quarterbacks are ranked higher than kickers. when we got k balls, beat them up slam them into benches, anything to try to make them a little more worn in so we could do our job better. >> tim, you think someone tampered intentionally here as well. along with chris, you say it didn't affect the outcome of the game. is there part of this scandal
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that does matter something that we should be paying attention to something that investigative reporters should follow up on? >> it matters in the sense that if someone broke the rules, you can't have that. the nfl doesn't want that. this is a team that had the spygate scandal several years ago. i disagree with chris slightly in that i think having deflated balls over time especially if you factor it in may explain why patriots have such a low fumble ratio. it's extraordinarily lower than any other team in the league. if in fact someone has been deflating the balls consistently throughout the last several seasons, then i think that over time it could have a statistical impact. as chris pointed out, the reason why he and his counter-parts who are kickers do everything single thing they can, because the nfl is a game it's a league where even the slightest advantage is
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something that everyone is seeking. because the line between winning and losing is so fine. so i'm not saying that it's tom brady or coach belichick. the lawyer in me says everyone is innocent until proven guilty. they have both denied any knowledge or wrongdoing and i would accept that. but i think that his explanation, the coach's explanation yesterday, didn't completely fulfill my idea that somebody tampered with these balls. >> that press conference i've never seen a press conference like that. do you think belichick handled this well coming out surprising the press with a press conference then showing up late to it and then going on and on about this? >> i think bill belichick is a master of strategy. his strategy right now is to win his fourth championship with the patriots and to beat the seattle seahawks. so what he needs to do is in
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that bigger game he's got to get people's minds off of this. he wants to dispense with this. he's come up with an argument as to what may have happened where no one tampered with the ball. it's a little thin but it's plausible. maybe this is what happened. what he did was, he was able to throw this out as an explanation and say to his team and the media, enough of this. we may never know but here is an explanation. we're talking and thinking about the seattle seahawks. >> and yet journalists are going to keep hounding him about this and keep investigating this. chris, do you think in some ways i don't mean to sound conspiratorial here nfl has bigger issues and bigger true scandals to deal with. is this somewhat good for them a distraction from the bigger stories? >> yeah i think this is one of the best things that could have happened to the nfl right now. i don't think they are in any
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way behind it. i don't think there was an organize push hey, let's reveal this patriots thing. but i do think with the deflategate, whatever you want to call it the fact is people aren't focusing on ray rice. >> you just said ballgazi. >> i know if carl bernstein was here he would say he hates deflategate or importance of benghazi. why is it we have to attach a label to the stories like ballghazi. >> it's an automatic thing. it's easier to transfer the information if you have a key word that symbolizes what you're talking about. people are familiar with watergate, benghazi. by labeling it as the same thing, under the circumstances that context and convey it's similar to that. >> what would you convey to the
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bigger stories you think should be getting more proceeds with the nfl? >> i think there are three main ones. there are the player discipline and domestic violence/criminal stuff that's going on. i think that's a really big one for the nfl. i think another one is the stadium situation where you have public financing going to privately owned stadiums. you know st. louis rams right now, case in appoint, they are essentially holding st. louis hostage and saying they will move to california if they don't get their money. the third one would be the medical issues. the fact that the nfl has done this concussion settlement but what are the protocols for players who qualify for that and does that mean that enough players will be qualifying for that money? or is it set up in a way where very, very few players will qualify to get a playout. >> tim, do stories like those need twitter friendly hash tags?
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>> look i think the nfl doesn't want this out there. it's slightly embarrassing to them. there focus -- i don't think their focus is to try to defract focus on these other issues. the issues have run their course. they are out there or they are not out there. i think really what this is this is a function of the nfl's own success. people pay such clothes attention to this. we've got a superstar quarterback and coach and team. they may have broken the rules or someone in there may have broken the rules. as the american public it's the lead story. i'm sorry to laugh but it's incredible to me but that's how much we care. we care about these teams. we care about the nfl. people are paying a lot of attention to it. on the more serious side of that we don't want our heroes to cheat.
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right? even if it's bending the rules a little bit, there are people who don't want that. we hold the nfl and everything about it to an incredibly high standard. i think that the name deflategate, i think it's just kind of funny. but it certainly isn't of the seriousness of watergate and benghazi. >> of course. >> even in the sports it's not as serious as spy gate where they were stealing signals, which wasn't that huge of a deal and certainly not on the same level as the bounty gate where new orleans saints players were being offered money to hurt opposing players. that is something on a completely other level. >> tim and chris, thank you both for being here this morning. great talking with you? >> thanks very much brian. >> thank you. >> i want to elaborate a bit on what tim was just saying on why this story has become so big, what it taps into in the public. we're going to talk about that.
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is the press, i'm sorry i have to say this overinflating coverage of the scandal. do my best sean hannity impression going to break, toss that football. be right back. enthusiast. mmm, a perfect 177-degrees. and that's why this road warrior rents from national. i can bypass the counter and go straight to my car. and i don't have to talk to any humans, unless i want to. and i don't. and national lets me choose any car in the aisle. control. it's so, what's the word?... sexy. go national. go like a pro. alright, so this tylenol arthritis lasts 8 hours but aleve can last 12 hours. and aleve is proven to work better on pain than tylenol arthritis. so why am i still thinking about this? how are ya? good. aleve. proven better on pain. [ female announcer ] we help make secure financial tomorrows a reality for over 19 million people. [ alex ] transamerica helped provide a lifetime of retirement income. so i can focus
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well catch the crazy pass sean hannity better at that than me. we're going to talk more about deflategate, i'm fascinated by the media coverage of this story. bill belichick made it clear he was sick about talking about this. he made it surreal instead of schemes for the super bowl belichick was dropping science knowledge to a whole room of reporters. but he may be over this. he may be tired of it but the media is not. the media finds this story to be irresistible. i want to explore some reasons why that is. i want to bring in guests who know better than anything lz
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granderson and chris, talk show host and columnist at the boston herald. thank you both for being here. >> thank you. >> chris, you're in boston. tell me what the feeling in the town is. is there a resentment for how the national media has come in and focused on deflategate and not the super bowl. >> for fans us circling wagons around patriots. it's similar to what happened seven or eight years ago with spy gate similar to what happens with any fan base who is under attack with the media. you get a good degree of healthy scepticism because of spy gate because of the reputation both proven and rumored of the patriots pushing the line a little bit and sometimes going across the line. i think you've seen a mixed reaction in that regard. certainly for fans they would rather be talking about seahawks post spy gate championship rather than weather
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another scandal. >> lz it seems to me this is made for news characters heroes and vil answerlains, what am i missing in that combination of factors? >> you have to remember this is more than just a game. this is a multi-billion dollar international industry that produced 20 of the 25 most broadcast in history. we're talking about a vital part of our dna in terms of pop culture. that also is fueling why this is such a story that it is is that the nfl is just a story. >> right. the super bowl next weekend is going to have at least 100 million viewers and those are just the ones neilson can count. they can't count viewing parties at bars and restaurants. no other gets 50 million viewers, it's going to have more than 100. you were telling this is a test early test of how they handle scandal in the wake of ray rice situation and others.
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>> absolutely. by no means is what deflategate represents on par with domestic violence or child abuse and other things we saw play out last year for nfl. what this does show us is whether or not nfl polices itself and improve the way it investigates players and franchises. it's a small test but important test. at the end of the day after all this comp fans are asking themselves now what. if the nfl has done all this investigation, if the nfl knows purposefully or not balls were deflated and that's against the rules, what exactly is the nfl going to do to enforce its rules. it's a small test but an important one after 2014. >> put a great headline survey data people's perceptions of the nfl. the headline here says that was quick. america has already forgiven the nfl. there's the headline. let's put up the poll on screen from a market research firm.
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you're going to see a big drop-off poll data 2013 2014 and 2015. maybe we can't put it up. but essentially it shows -- i can draw it with my hands here. nfl perception is high drop with ray rice and back to where they were after that ray rice scandal, after that domestic abuse talk. chris, that tells me there's nothing that can cause viewers to give up on the nfl. really important scandals about domestic violence and cheating like deflategate. >> yeah i just think it shows the game is a machine. it's been rolling along for a while and continuing to grow. i do think it's worth pointing out even though the shield of the nfl has been tarnished, the vast majority of guys who play football people cheer for every sunday are pretty good guys law abiding guys who do their business their job and live life the same way. i do think people can
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compartmentalize unsavory aspects of nfl and not support those while supporting their teams and vast majority of players that frankly aren't involved in some of the things that have gone on this year. >> chris, lz thanks for being here. a great conversation to have. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> the pro bowl coming up later today. super bowl media day coming up on tuesday. there will be plenty more on this story. i'm sure cnn will be covering it all this week from phoenix, the site of the super bowl. coming up she is back. sarah palin taking center stage in iowa yesterday at a very interesting summit a number of presidential contenders. we're looking at red news, blue news reaction right after this.
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thanks for staying with us. time for red news blue news time to examine how a single story is differently in yesterday's iowa freedom summit a perfect example. 300 journalists attend said a lot about 2016 presidential race based on which conservative candidates were taken seriously and which ones were not and by which media outlet. take a look at this fox news highlight reel. we sped it up a little bit, ted cruz rick santorum what, here she comes, donald trump, sarah palin, chris christie mike huckabee notably jeb bush
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rubio skipped the event. should they take sarah palin seriously when she says she's seriously interested in running for president. should they take donald trump serious at all? on the topic of trump, i don't think so. how they buried an issue of sarah palin at the end of a segment this morning. >> i'm being told sarah palin was there and has said she might run for president. >> one in a million chance. there's a chance. >> right. exactly. one in a million. >> overnight politicos wrote republican clown car has become a clown van. to have viewers, readers, dismissing palin's chances or even trumps is disrespect. good for views, clicks and ratings. fox thought so. it thought palin's speech
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deserved it's own headline. others called her speech incoherent. she is by the way a paid fox contributor. she was on the air identified that way, fox's policy is contributors have to leave when they take concrete steps toward running for president. like setting up exploratory committee. ben carson left last fall mike huckabee left last month. what's going to happen to palin? i asked fox this morning, so far no comment. out to iowa political reporters robert costa in new york. with me senior analyst jeffrey toobin. you asked palin about 2016 on friday. that's when she said she was seriously interested in running. you've seen analysts roll their eyes at palin. how do you handle this? do you take her interest seriously some of it's not my job to judge sarah palin's political intentions but i did want to ask the question. i saw she had given an interview to abc news thursday.
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her answer about 2016 seemed a little vague. i was staking out marriott hotel lobby in des moines. i saw her come in close to midnight. i really had to press her two or three times to clarify exactly where she stood. she said i'm, quote, seriously considering the idea. that's what i printed and reported. she's a former vice presidential candidate. i thought it was worth at least getting her comment out there. >> and yet jeffrey, so many people don't take her seriously. they laugh at the idea she could run again and don't believe she's going to. they believe she's just doing it for commercial gain. >> i think what makes this such a difficult race to cover is the complete absence of a real front-runner. who is the serious candidate? usually candidates in the high teens would sort of be dismissed as irrelevant. but the highest any candidate is polling in this race is high teens, jeb bush mitt romney chris christie. they are -- i would hesitate to
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call them front-runners, but even they are at a very, very low rate. so it's very hard to say ben carson is a ridiculous candidate, sarah palin is a ridiculous candidate. >> not even ridiculous but in it for something else besides a nomination to be president. >> that's a very hard thing to judge, reading someone's intent. i'm sure sarah palin would like to be president. but is she going to give up her fox gig and risk the embarrassment? >> robert? >> i think one thing i've learned covering national politics for a couple years, it's really best sometimes to reserve editorial judgment. it's the only way to go when you're reporting on some of these candidates. i think the greatest example was in 2012 when i was covering rick santorum. no one gave him a shot. they thought he was doing it for tv. he ended up winning iowa caucuses. you have to pay attention early to get traction. >> isn't it a problem you have
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so many candidates you have to decide which to cover. have you to decide which candidate to mention in a story. you can't mention all ten of them. you do have to make some sort of judgment about who is a serious candidate and who is not, right? >> that's true. one thing i was watching yesterday with my colleague, not who was there but who improved their standing. ben carson maybe not on the radar with mp what did he do. carly fiorina. fewer people there knew her but she gave a well received speech about hillary clinton. that's what you're trying to look for, who is pushing the ball forward for their own political future. >> chuck todd had a sick burn on meet the press. he said nobody is going to mistake donnell trump for president except donald trump. he's the the best example promoting it for his commercial business. >> he runs this scam every year.
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>> it's a scam. >> it's a total scam running for president. i think this time around fewer people will fall for it. i think he's getting the ignoring the disdain that he so richly deserves. >> really interesting intention we're talking about that on the one hand and you're saying robert on the other hand to keep editorializing out of it, report what people are saying and let people decide in iowa a year from now. >> i think, for example, donald trump, does he do this perennially and tease the press and voters? of course he does. that's just a fact. however, when you listen to his speech yesterday, he for the first time talked about filing papers looking forward to filing papers and revealing his financial statements. for someone who is always -- right, i agree with you. >> robert come on. >> you have to take everything he says with a grain of salt. my point is it's hard to predict with some of these unpredictable politicians will do. >> robert before we have to go do you have any sense of what
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sarah palin is thinking in regard to fox? we did see mike huckabee leave his show a few weeks ago because he's getting serious about running for president. we have not seen sarah palin do the same. >> governor palin told me she's, quote, seriously interested in the idea. when i pressed whether she's ramping up her political operation, she said she is not, it's just an idea. >> it's all about hot air, right? >> is a good theme for the whole show. jeffrey toobin robert costa, thank you both being here. i'm a little better catching than i am passing. after quick break i want to turn to something meaningful yesterday. here in new york i interviewed four parents of the victims of colorado movie shooting. they told me why they think we and the press should not name the shooter show the shooter's face. i want to show you why it changed my mind. a really important interview coming up after this. andrew hunter debating who will
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welcome back to "reliable sources." let me ask you something i've never asked before should the news media name mass shooters show their faces? my instinct is yes. journalists are taught to show the truth, whole truth no matter how sinister it is. parents of victims killed in aurora, colorado inside that movie theater on july 20th
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2012. this week as 9,000 people were summoned in jury selection for the shooting suspects family members launched no not to show them on air or online. before i sat down with the families i was planning on saying the aurora's killers name and showing his face on screen. what they said was persuasive. i think sometimes they have to if their histories, show their faces. we have to think about the impact repetitive media images can have. we have to consider these families arguments as alex's dad tom said they are members of a club with the highest admission fee. no one wants to join. once you're in you can never get out. listen to tom and his wife karen joined by lonnie and his wife. see if they can change your
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mind. tom, i want to start with you and ask you about the first time you saw the face of the man who killed your child and heard the name. what stood out to you in that moment? >> we had landed the night before in hawaii to go on vacation. at 4:340 in the morning hawaii time amanda alexed girlfriend love of his life so to speak, rang my phone and said tom, there was a shooting. we're at the theater. there was a shooting. i tried to wake him up but they pulled me away. i said where is alex? she said they made me leave him. they made me leave him. then we spent trying to call hospitals at 4:45 in the morning hawaii time. then we turned on the television. we could find out nothing other than seeing that thing's face and what that thing did. there wasn't anything about any victims. there was nothing. i couldn't even leave the
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television on because i was going to break it. that's the first time i saw his face. >> when you say thing, you're doing that on purpose. >> because he's not human. what human being would walk in and take a machine gun and start shooting people in a theater. he shot a six-year-old girl point-blank. that's a human being? if that's a human being, that's a race i don't want to belong to. >> i asked about that day because that day led to this day. karen you've led the charge on a campaign called no notoriety for gunmen like this man. what spurred you to want to do this? >> well the quest for notoriety and infamy is a known factor for people who want to commit mass killing or copy cats. all we're asking is after the initial identification of a mass killer set up the initial
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identification and throughout the article or newscast just refer to them as the shooter, the defendant. it's not that difficult. i also ask them to stand in my shoes. stand in the shoes of a parent who had a child brutally murdered by someone that their only motivation was to have their face splattered all over every ounce of media out there. i have a feeling that whoever writes this article will do their best to limit that name. >> lonnie and sandy, you're wearing the same buttons as well relaying the message. i'm hearing tom and karen say they have been thinking about this every since the shooting thinking media should not give names and show faces. when did you start thinking about this? >> immediately. i remember the same day. we were lucky we knew jessie was gone. we knew early on.
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we didn't have to go through the search and questioning, where is she, was she in the hospital? >> because she was put in an ambulance and taken to the hospital. >> we knew because her face was the first platstered over the news. she was the first victim. but other than that it was the picture of the killer. >> i remember turning on cnn and turning the television on that morning and that's the first image that i saw. and i actually threw up and had dry heaves every time his picture came on. it still does that to me. so we're already victims and we get revictimized over and over and over again by seeing that picture, hearing his names, having to deal with all the things we have to deal with just to survive getting out of bed. >> two and a half years later trial starting it's going to start all over again and it's not going to be like it's been two and a half years.
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it's going to be like it was yesterday. >> lonnie you wrote an essay for "politico", the killer i refuse to name. you said the judges decision in this trial means the killer's need for a worldwide stage outweighs the victims. that's because he decided to allow one camera inside the trial. are you at peace with that decision? >> it's my feeling that the trial would be covered just as well without the camera. the camera is going to create an electronic record of media that's going to be on youtube. it will be there forever to be replayed over and over again. not necessary. it's really not necessary for the outcome of the trial to be any different. he was unable to provide any kind of proof that having cameras there would better serve justice, so why have them? >> so when you bring this up to journalists, what do they tell you? what are the reasons? >> first off, we have to tell the story.
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quite frankly, i think you're hiding behind it. facts are data is unsur mountable that it is the material reason they do this. >> do you buy into the slippery slope argument if journalists make this choice there could be other choices down the road harmful. >> you've already made it. you don't name children. you've already made it. tell me the relevance of whether you put the thing's picture and its name on television or you just say the shooter and then you do the rest of what you were going to do other than you think it draws viewers and clicks and ratings and creates revenue. if we want this to stop and i would assume cnn wants it to stop you could make an argument that from a revenue generating perspective, it's a big boon for you guys. >> it's a horrifying thing to say. >> it is a horrifying thing but it happens every day. >> i wonder what would happen if there was a blackout.
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there was no photo, no name. i do think people learn from looking into the eyes of a madman? >> i have looked into his eyes. that killer was very detached when they were speaking of the lives that it took. and other aspects. the moment a photo of himself was up on the small screen his eyes lit up. i saw a small smile. i could see his eyes crinkle with delight. it made me physically ill. i've seen it. i've seen it with my own eyes. they crave it. they like it. you're giving it to them. we're asking you to take it away. >> i guess as a journalist you have to decide whether you want to be walter cronkite or tmz. that's basically the choice. do you want to tell the truth and do what you have through the medieval times, your role in society, because it's a very, very important role.
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i have huge respect for you guys. but which do you want to be? you have to choose. you can't do it halfway. >> you have to feed the beast. we get that how much do you have to feed that beast and when does it cross the line from being factual to being sensationalism. i think that's where we need to go with this whole conversation really what do you have to do? >> i actually challenged anderson on camera. >> anderson cooper in the parking lots covering one of the story. >> i said i'll give you a challenge. don't name him. can you get through the next 12 minutes without naming him. stop naming him. it's awful for us okay but the reality is it could be awful for anybody in this room. what you're doing, making a call to action for all the people out there that need the motivation
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to move from thought to action. >> you believe that the media was not giving saturation coverage to them you believe they would not go through with it? >> i believe they would go through with it, maybe not the next one. >> we're asking for the media not to turn our children's deaths into a form of entertainment. stick to the facts. don't lend notoriety to these killers. this is not for your entertainment. these are our lives. these are our children's lives that once were and that's also what we're asking. >> as soon as we started talking, i noticed lonnie gripped sandy's hand and karen reached for tom's hand. for them this is not a tragedy in the past it is very much in the present and always will be. we'll be right back. when heartburn comes creeping up on you... fight back with relief so smooth...'s fast. tums smoothies starts dissolving the instant it touches your tongue ...and neutralizes stomach acid at the source. ♪ tum, tum tum tum...♪ smoothies! only from tums.
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new this morning, box office numbers that are surprising hollywood once again. take a look at this headline. i just put the story up on "american sniper" hauls in $200 million at the box office. it's only been out ten days nationwide. almost no r rated movie has done that before this. movie is on track to beat "the passion of the christ" as the highest grossing r rated film in american history. it has already become the highest grossing january movie release. it's receiving a whole lot of critical praise. for the first time there is a truly popular movie about the iraq war. even ""the hurt locker"" didn't do nearly as much at the box office as this movie has. the film is fueling political
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debate for its somewhat black and white portrayal of one of the most famed legendary but controversial figure chris kyle known as america's most lethal sniper. he is depicted rightfully so as a hero in the film. based on his book "american sniper." in the past kyle made a number of bizarre accusations reporters have failed to confirm. he died two years ago tragically. the trial for his alleged killer is about to get under way. but all of that issue, all of those controversies are now back in the forefront because of this movie and because of the astonishing popularity of it. i want to talk about that with two guests who know very well and have a lot of experience on this. let me bring in paul reichoff executive director and john former navy s.e.a.l. i appreciate you being here this morning. paul it was you who got me thinking about the importance of this movie to american people
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to have people go and see a movie that connects them to a veteran's experience is
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